it's starting to get interesting / ugly...

interesting. seller must have swapped from elliman to halstead.. looked at history of this apt before, now i can see why they dropped the first broker..STREETEASY HISTORY

08/31/2007
Previous sale closed for $1,555,500
05/13/2008
Listed in StreetEasy by Elliman at $1,950,000
07/28/2008
Price decreased to $1,850,000
08/12/2008
Price decreased to $1,799,000
09/25/2008
Price decreased to $1,775,000
10/31/2008
Price decreased to $1,725,000
11/08/2008
Price decreased to $1,699,000
11/22/2008
Price decreased to $1,650,000
12/17/2008
Price decreased to $1,599,000
02/11/2009
Elliman listing de-listed
02/19/2009
Listed in StreetEasy by Halstead Property for $1,495,000

Yup... all signs of a desperate seller

They owe about $1.1MM on the first lien; looks like they paid off the second. So they still might get out alive, but they'll probably lose most of their equity. I think the bigger problem is their clothing business. The competition for offshore production orders (in their case, China) is cruel.

@ West81st: you know the sellers of this apartment personally? or met them before?

west81st.. my personal view, probably to keep personal information private. i think it;s interesting to see what the market is doing.. but i wld not want to actually put the sellers in a bad situation.

Jenny9823: Sorry if I crossed a line there. My guideline is not to post details that a competent websurfer couldn't find within five minutes, using some combination of Streeteasy, Google and ACRIS. In this case, it took about thirty seconds. I don't think the information is personal or private. Any prospective buyer (and/or her broker) is going to see it. If the sellers are in a bad position, they're in a bad position; nothing we post here about their mortgage or their business is going to make any difference.

Also, Jenny9823, when you start a discussion thread about a specific listing, and comment that "It's starting to get interesting/ugly", it might be a little disingenuous to wag your finger when another poster adds color to the story.

west 81: a LITTLE? You ma'am are too kind by half methinks.

I don't understand the theme of this posting that this listing shows things getting ugly. To me it shows another overpriced (to me 1200 sf is overpriced perse, and when/if prices ever fall by 40% etc. as many beleive, you will not be seeing prices per sf at that level) apartment with a delusional asking price that is still roughly near the closing price during the peak year of 2007.

so to me this post has things backwards -- this is NOT a sign of things getting nasty.

West81st:
you do start to creep me out. You seem to spend tremendous amount of time digging out unnesessary and UNRELATED TO SELLING OR BYUING ANYTHING info on unsuspecting people. What's wrong with you.

nothing is wrong...if you don't like it, get lost.

columbiacounty, you'd probably enjoy seeing your address and financial obligations of you and yours being posted on a public anonymous forum. Most people wouldn't. Don't be rude.

columbiacounty - you get lost! W 81st crossed the line & she apologized for it. Apparently you are the only person who thinks posting personal and private information about people here is proper. If it had been about me, I would have been furious. Financial hardship is a gut wrenching and difficult experience for families, let alone be broadcasted on a discussion board for all to read.

How many of their friends and neighbors will read this potentially?!? You are a heartless person if you don't think anything is wrong with this.

Osiris: I agree having such easy access to these details is creepy, and maybe my lack of respect for sellers' privacy is a little creepy too. But I strongly disagree with your assertion that a sellers' circumstances are "unrelated to buying or selling anything". In most cases, the seller's circumstances are the motivation behind a sale. Those circumstances also tell a buyer a great deal about the seller's level of urgency and pricing flexibility. I would even say that in the buyer's market that is taking shape, knowledge of a seller's situation -used with skill - will be a much more powerful asset than any comp analysis.

That said, I do see your point, and I'll dial down the posting of non-bovious details.

Sorry, that should be "non-obvious." I'll keep cows out of it too.

hold on...did you rely on public information or inside information?

regardless of whether it was public info or inside, it is very creepy to broadcast that info. w81, seems you have too much time on your hand.. better pick up a hobby rather than trying to figure out all the distressed finanical situations people are in..

note the original thread " IT'S STARTING TO GET INTERESTING / UGLY..." both are true

West81st:
would you approach any other financial transaction with the same reasoning? Such as your landlord or your loan officer digging up your health records, or your contractor digging up your bank balance?
The sellers are selling what they own and paid for, and that's it. Who they are or why they sell has no bearing on the fact, save for blackmail.
What do you mean by "knowledge of a seller's situation -used with skill - will be a much more powerful asset than any comp analysis."?

but we're all sitting here reading it...

blackmail? isn't that a little over the top?

who is blackmailing whom? who is profiting? perhaps you may want to lighten up a bit.

Easy there lads..."non-bovious details" is certainly a word that should be in the dictionary. What it really means is that most Manhattan brokers are derived from the bovine family and can't be bothered with important details. That is to say, I couldn't wash them in my main dishwasher. "So Betsy, isn't Dolly just soooo bovious, I can't stand it". It certainly may have been used out of context, but I love the new word. Thanks, 81. Public info should ALWAYS be used in a financial negotiation, I think everyone on this thread would agree that if you used a bovine to help you acquire a property, and said bovine failed to disclose some negative news about seller, you would sue them. So quit whining. All is fair in sex, war, politics and RE transactions. Shut up and shop.

columbia, the line between public and private information is already very blurred. Let's start with your IP address (there are ways) and take it from there...

Columbia: All public, from ACRIS and the sellers' own website.

It's really not worth arguing about. If Osiris and jsmith9005 were offended, others probably would be too. I'll just stop. It was a slow week, that's all.

P09: Thanks.

Thanks, West81st.

Wow I didn't mean to spark this kind of conversation at all.. just wondering where West81 got his info--thats all

no biggie

hey...what about blackmail?

sounds like you're threatening me with ??

frankly, I think the info that west 81st is providing is helpful if someone is interested in this particular property.

cc:hey...what about blackmail?

you lost me at hello!

west81st. wasnt trying to wag my finger to scold... all i was doing was looking at pricing history and seeing some changes. just seemed like an interesting example - maybe my subject for this link was unnecessarily sensationalitic (is this a word?) but i was tlking about the market as a whole with this specific example.. just dont want anyone to get hurt at all from this.... in fact, i may stop posting specific price moves etc altogether if people (specifically the sellers) might think it malicious.

like many, im just interested in researching datapoints in the market to see if (1) we made the right decision to sell back in october and (2) when the right point to come back into the market is.

also west81st, re your due diligence argument , i agree. if i was a buyer in this market, i would do as much google searching about the buyer as i can. and if it's available, i would use it to my advantage.

Jenny9823: No worries. It's a fine line, and I crossed it.

this is too funny...i love how scared people get when some "personal" info (which is by no means personal) gets mentioned.
Everything you do is tracked and available for people to see...if you can't face that, drop off the grid, move to Antarctica, and become a hunter/gatherer.
Otherwise, remember the next time you throw you're credit statement away, someone is probably digging through your trash to get at it.
Welcome to America

Big babies
And you're welcome to my IP address...go for it.

LMAO... I'm w/ u upperwestrenter... all the haterade is misdirected to w81st... he's a fine man IMHO. Who amongst us hasn't zillowed a boss, ex-wife, girlfriend, HS friend? If you are pissed on all this info... go blame google, zillow, ACRIS, newspapers etc... yep it's just one lady in Omaha that buys 10MM yearly subscriptions to PEOPLE magazine... another funny, do you know they've done studies where a monkey was given a choice of looking at an alpha male/female versus eating a favorite food, and that damn monkey would rather stare at the other monkey..... we are no different... we're just monkeys in Prada shoes :), so I love the color in these RE transactions provided by west81.

If anyone here thinks I should feel sorry for anyone in NYC that can't service a $1MM + mortgage, I would direct you to any of the millions of people starving in the world or who don't have access to clean water on a daily basis...

My IP address is also wide open... but be warned... I've got an attorney on retainer and I don't back down in court when I think I'm in the right, got a $50K attorney bill to prove it :). There are certain lines that one shouldn't cross and w81's was nowhere near that line IMHO.

W81st:

ACRIS is fair game and factual. This gives information about a typical distressed sale. So would information on realtytrac about Lis Pendings, 1st and second mortgage, etc... It tells you about whether the unit is likely in the hands of an owner who has speculated on the purchase by over extending.

I suspect many (50%) of the units bought pre-construction were speculators whether they moved into the unit or not. People bought who thought that they could flip. When circumstances prevent the flip and the payments overwhelm their ability to carry their speculative investment, it leads to what I believe will be a large number of distressed sales. No professional real estate investor (REIT) would buy at these cap rates, so there are no greater fools to unload to. The results will bring the apartment pricing down to the economic levels that reflect their risk -- the 9 to 10% cap rates seen in the REITs and other professional landlord investment. I have heard from at least one investor that the going rate for purchasing blocks of rental apartments is 700 psf on the UWS against a net rental income of 4 psf per month, or 48 per year. Thus, the wholesale price of these apartments is a cap rate of 48/700 or 7%. Still higher than the cap rate on this apartment of of 4%, though lower than the implied liquid market determined cap rates of the REITs. So this investor/owner is in on a mortgage that won't be covered if purchasers are not willing to pay the 4% cap rate. Now that is valuable information for one apartment, and I thank w81st for sharing it so that I would not need to dig thru ACRIS to find the same thing.

There is a large block of new supply on RSB/WEA/W59-61st that needs to be moved. The first round of flippers are now showing market prices that will just barely allow them to get out alive on their 2006-2008 purchases. But there is too much supply for this to clear in the current Wall Street bonus market. The developers and their banks holding large blocks of new inventory coming on line now are in an even worse position as they cannot afford to pollute their market by showing lower prices, or their entire equity goes negative. The owner/investors can at least save their shirts by hitting bids now. The developers are boxed in and wishing/hoping/praying for some miracle that will get people to pay more than REIT implied cap rates for their inventory. We will see how this plays out.

Thanks for the color w81st. Don't be afraid to post _factual_ information obtained from reliable sources, as long as you quote your sources. Avoid adding color based on your opinion of a particular person because this is not factual, but speculation. I for one want to know about their first and second mortgage situation if you can get it from ACRIS. (Your opinion on their clothing business is unnecessary.)

The information is personal but not at all private-- this is an important distinction. Unless you can make the case that there is some legitimate expectation of privacy with respect to the easily accessible, publicly available facts W81 has shared on this board, I simply don't see the ethical problem here. I haven't read anything remotely approaching such an argument from those of you who find W81's post ethically objectionable. These sellers are "private" citizens, but they're offering a commodity for sale on an open "public" market. Would you have the same objection to trying to gather as much publicly available information about the financial situation of a residential real estate developer if you're contemplating a bid on a condo/co-op that developer is trying to sell? That information could be enormously useful in making strategic and tactical decisions in the bidding process. These are arms-length transactions in a capitalist economy. Knowledge is power . . . and market value. I don't think W81 crossed any ethical line at all.

Another thread gave negotiating tips and all agreed that information is key--that is what West81 found--I don't think any line was crossed-- because of the Internet, rules of privacy and access have changed--we have to get used to it (and use what's available --like Michael Corleone said, "it's not personal, it's business."

Come on now. How useful and "key" is this information W.81st gave? Finding a good deal with key information involves keeping this upper hand knowledge PRIVATE. Meaning that if you truly find a fabulous deal or know something that will help you negotiate better to get you that fabulous deal, you keep it to yourself. Advertising it on a discussion board here will only diminish the usefulness of it.

Therefore, elaborating it here & revealing someone's personal information in the process to the general readers does no good. It only serves to highlight someone's financial hardship and embarass them.

anon10: Being entrepreneurs in a brutally competitive business, with complex operations overseas, trying to navigate through a global economic crisis, doesn't seem like cause for embarrassment. It probably sheds some light on their motivation for selling a year-old condo, that's all.

I know almost nothing about this particular apparel firm. I do know a bit about the sector, and it's a very tough one, especially now. That's all I meant in speculating that their business might be the issue. I think that's a reasonable inference, but maybe they just want to move.

Anyway, for those of us who enjoy leavening our market chatter with a bit of gossip, it's easy enough to exchange this sort of material off-line. As a courtesy to more sensitive posters, that's what we should probably do.

no one has responded to my point: if the apt is now offered near (less than 5% lower) the 2007 peak price, IN WHAT WAY DOES THIS POSTING SHOW THINGS GETTING UGLY, ? Nothing -- decreases from higher asking prices means nothing really

i thought the "ugly" was in reference to the broker pointing out in this listing that the apartment directly above it is listed at $315,000 higher. i think the brokers turning on each other in such a public way was what she was referring too. although the op can feel free to let me know if i am off base.

jasonkyle: Not only is that pitch ugly, it's also misleading. The $1.81MM figure for #27D is a Corcoran-Sunshine "list" price that hasn't budged in seven months. If you walked into the sales office today, I guarantee you could buy #27D for a lot less than $1.81MM. Would Corcoran match Halstead's price? Maybe not, but I bet it would be close.

Right on. Ever since I saw my first web page in 1994, I've been hyper vigilant about my digital trail. There's nothing I can do about my ACRIS trail, but that's it. I do lots of stuff online, but I'm not google-able even though my name is unusual. And I'd like to keep it that way. Lots of people do (IMO) stupid things like post millions of pictures on flickr, facebook, blogs...

Come on, Anon. Here's the deal, and here is why it isn't creepy: W81st could easily determine the identity of the seller. That can be done in 90 seconds, and if you don't know how, then you're limiting yourself in silly ways. Once that's done, insight into the price history and status of course is enhanced by knowing the situation of buyer. Hasn't everyone read an article for buyers advising that "a bassinette in the diningroom is a sure sign the seller is in a hurry" or suggesting that the buyer be aware of the deadlines for estate taxes to determine the level of desperation of heirs/sellers? Information is power and is important in negotiating to purchase property. What's available on the Internet now is fair game. Sorry, folks, but that's today's reality and sellers just have to be aware of what the real world looks like in 2009. It's no different from a small town where everyone knows who is in financial trouble, and business is done accordingly.

Well maybe ugly was meant to refer to the broker reference but I hardly consider that dramatic news or "ugly". It's just common sense to point out. But there are references above in this thread to "desperate seller", etc.......but......but.....but....the apt is still listed at near the peak price, so what is desperate about that? Isn't this listing (and more so the one above) evidence thatmany, many sellers are actually NOT listing at anything near the 30% or more discounts people on this website talk about all the time.

when I say "peak" I mean the actual sales price from the peak year of 2007, because earlier askings at ridiculous prices mean nothing.

nyc10023 completely agree with you.
Try
www.Spokeo.com
and a query on your email address,,,
I started to delete several public profiles after that

nyc10023--Can you provide tipes on how to stop from being google-able?

West81st, please keep the color coming. The info is public and easily attainable, so you are not crossing the line. Rather, you are doing a service for me and other SE lurkers by adding color to what's going on in the market. If you want to be more polite, perhaps leave off the names of the individuals involved as that provides the least value and may lead random Internet searches of an individual back to SE. You didn't do it here, but I think you have in the past; I don't personally care, but if you want to be somewhat more respectful of privacy, that might be a better way to go. But other than that, I don't see how saying that someone somewhere bought an apt for X, had mortgage Y, and is in business Z results in a lack of privacy. The snoopy reader still needs to connect the name by doing some snooping, in which case it is they who are crossing the "privacy" line.

West81st..plse keep the information coming...if you hired a private detective to find the info that would be somewhat wrong but you're helping all of us and many more so a big thank you.

A big thumbs up to you W81. As someone quite new to real estate in NY, I've learnt so much from reading your posts. Thank you and keep 'em coming!

Thanks all. I took Patient09's advice and went shopping. Thirteen open houses in three hours.

Inonada makes a really good point about the use of names creating permanent search index entries. I think we can all agree that names should be off-limits, except celebrities. Beyond that, I think we should just try to be polite.

for whatever it's worth, I think W81's posting was totally appropriate - a financial distress of a seller is totally pertinent information. The fact that W81 got it via three clicks on the internet (rather than digging through the seller's garbage) makes it doubly appropriate to discuss. W81 - I think you should keep posting stuff like that - it is not gossip and it is relevant. I, for one, have learned a lot about what info is out there that can influence my bidding process

something interesting regarding rentals...waterside plaza at 25th street (doorman, etc.) just lowered their studios from $1900 to $1500 and one bedroom from $2500 to $2200..rentals are coming down very quickly hopefully that will happen to co-ops, condos.

W81, I think that in addition to celebrities in terms of names, you should add public figures and the top 5 executives and the next top 20 earners at any firm receiving future TARP funds: i.e., the usual cast of characters who are subject to public flogging these days. (Tongue is in cheek.)

When I sold my apartment last summer it was the subject of several threads on Streeteasy. I wanted to jump in and explain why a bidder hadn't been taken seriously but I didn't want to jinx the sale and it didn't seem right for me to partake in a conversation about my own apartment
Though I had taken anything that could identify me out of the apartment I felt naked and exposed. Then I realized to much of the rest of the world I was coming into a great deal of money, and in certain senses, when you sell a somewhat desirable apartment in Manhattan you become a quasi-public figure. I realized how easy it was to identify me through the places West81st Street said and took it on faith that nobody would. But it did make me uncomfortable

West81st represents the best of NY to me. I always enjoy her posts and didn't see information in her comment that made the names of the people jump out at me

Don't worry, if you're not Angelina Jolie, I won't stalk you!

BTW, 13 houses in 3 hours and you are not seriously in the market? We all like to visit the occasional open house for no reason, but what you have there is a sickness, my friend. Don't be surprised if one day you find your SE bretheren at your apt after one of your Sunday feeding frenzies waiting for you to do an intervention.

As a great shrink once told me. Everyone has their demons, you just leave mine alone!

I too have sold an apartment that was the subject of much discussion on the web. Luckily, everyone was respectful enough to keep my name out of it, so I wouldn't be googleable forever. Hmm, 13 houses in 3 hours, I can't get around that fast even when I keep it local on the UWS unless I take a cab. And that would be spending $, and I'm cheap.

West81st: have you seen 240 West End? I was there today...

How was 240? The 2 bed/2 bath?

Sorry everyone, but there's a huge difference between what you can do, and what you should do.. here's another good example where w81 needs to step away from the keyboard once in a while..

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/talk/discussion/8697-what-world-do-these-people-live-in

Only the 1-bedroom is completely finished. Finishes are okay, nothing special. Looks like they're pricing at just under 1000/sqft except for the full-floor apt which is the one I'm interested in.

at the risk of being repetitious, if you don't like it...leave.

nyc10023: No - I was on foot, and time was limited, so my southern boundary was 77th Street.

jsmith9005: I agree. There are also several regrettable examples in the "If you can demonstrate market movement with comps..." threads. Your point is taken. If I do it again, please call me on it.

Why is anybody complain about buyers investigating sellers before making a price? Sellers in coops do this to buyers. In a free market the price should include all public information. If West81 is reporting public information. What is the problem?

^complaining

80sMan: It was rude, that's all. It doesn't bother me when anyone else does it. I just don't want to be the one that does it anymore.

jsmith9005 is right. Sometimes, it's a good idea to step away from the keyboard and ask, "Do I really need to post this?" Or at least to look for a way to convey any useful information without being hurtful.

Jsmith, I don't understand, can you clarify? You didn't explain what was wrong with that post. To me, it was helpful to understand the situation of the sellers to get an understanding of the market, just as it is helpful to know what's happening with prices. I don't know any more about the specific person than before reading the post, so what's the issue? I do know a bit more about the types of decisions people were / are making. It is very helpful to get a picture of the market beyond just the numbers.

West81st, surely you remember the laywer who posted the "bad food" sign above the "Kenny Rogers Roasters" on 71st? You have the right to state your opinion. Which is why blogs are so popular. Don't let anyone scare you into relinquishing your civil rights (the gov't will do that for you just fine). Even if you are crazy, you still can post all the public info and personal commentary you like.

you should, of course, do and act as you choose. however, to the extent that rudeness is defined by the community at large, I think it is clear that a majority (and boy do i have problems with that in general0 do not believe that you have been rude.

and, from the volume of posts, i think we can all agree that there are some strong feelings about all of this.

i personally hate it when people criticize each other for calling it the way it is.

It just business...I can't remember how many times over the last twenty years, the bovine (agents) have said to me, "you know who the owner is and they are very well off, they need to sell, if you want it, you need to be very aggressive". It is funny how so many of the conventions in the up market are turning out to be not welcome in the down market. I want a car service, a very cute driver, a martini, shaken, not stirred, otherwise I won't attend your open house!

i agree...can't stand all the scolding

West81st did not cross the line at all IMHO, and his participation is greatly appreciated by me.
The data was relevant to the discussion and is *public record*. I find it comical that the government is going through such great length to provide make these records easily available, yet he gets scolded for accessing and applying it.
Besides, he did not post the seller's name. It appears to me 'personal' information can hardly be personal when there is no name attached to it.
West81st: Don't let other harangue you into censuring your posts.

Here, here.

The title for this thread is perfect ;)

what exactly is going on in here???

:) big smiles to all!!

West 81st I love everything you write and I do not think you cross any lines since it is all public info. You educate us how to do due dillegence. I actually think your posts consistently have content. THANK YOU. I look fwd to your open house reports.

ditto onthesidelines and bela...

West 81st--I join the ranks of ditto, bela and all of your other numerous fans on SE--don't do anything differently. Your previous notes have shown that you are nothing if not thoughtful, serious, and reasonable. You always bring level-headedness and meaningful substance to any thread you contribute towards.

PS--West 81st, I'd be willing to contribute some $$$ for taxifare if you'd be willing to tour Tribeca OH's too . . .

"West81st did not cross the line at all IMHO." i second that one.

- a huge fan of West81st

anon10 said: "columbiacounty - you get lost! ... If it had been about me, I would have been furious"

Who gives a fukc what you think? Look, this is isn't Ma and Pa Kettle losing the family farm: These are flippers who BOUGHT this place hoping to make a *QUICK BUCK* by exploiting someone else. And the music stopped before they could. Boo-frickin' hoo. BOO FRICKIN' HOO!!!!!!

some people here at their finest and angriest, c0lumbiac0unty in the lead. capped off by Dwayne_Pipe

I had no idea that W81st was a precursor to NWT. I am glad NWT picked up the torch.

>NYCnovice - no, 2 different people.

Yes, I mean precursor in the predecessor sense, not the biochemical sense! I did not think even for a minute that they were one and the same individual. What I noticed in this thread was W81st providing exactly the type of incredibly helpful publicly available factual color that NWT does, but then saying he is not going to do it anymore. I am glad that NWT started doing it after that; maybe NWT was doing it before that. I have no idea; this thread predates me, and I had not come across it in my old thread reading, which is still a hobby, so I actually like it when FC revives one of the oldies but goodies.

Could, in your opinion, you, in your opinion, help, in your opinion, clarify, in your opinion, NYCNovice?
This thread, in my opinion, started in February 2009.
Multicityrenter joined, in my opinion, in January 2009: http://streeteasy.com/talk/discussion/32183-confessions-of-mcr

You do realize that Hb was the poster responsible for my creating NYCNovice to ask question regarding second rental in NYC. Also, please take note that this is perfect example of user creating new user name to coincide with new phase of NYC experience - keep going; you will see it all makes sense. To the extent anything doesn't make sense, I remain happy to answer relevant questions. I must say that I am happy our DC address is not a matter of public record anywhere, although I am pretty sure NWT could figure it out. One of the many things that surprised me in going through coop process is that many buildings do not let trusts hold the shares.

Responsible?

Sorry, I forgot I was dealing with someone who is, in my opinion, a member of the Tea Party.

Did you forget that you were a lawyer?
What do you mean by responsible? Were you saying it in a legal sense?

Since you've advised that one, some or all posters, when addressing you, referencing you, or being involved in any capacity with you on this message board have to treat you in a manner fitting an attorney - this is my interpretation of your statements on the other thread and since I am not a lawyer does not constitute any legal opinion or anything carrying any more weight than an anonymous lay poster on a message board, so feel free to clarify - when you, since you are an attorney, use a term such as responsible, should we assume (in our interpretation) that such term has some legal meaning?

Also, didn't you say you were a supporter of Donald Trump and Jeb Bush?

NYCNovice?

I said I would answer relevant questions, not nonsensical ones. We are done here with this post-script: When MCR joined streeteasy in early 2009, it was purely for the data. I do recall checking out the discussion section briefly, which, at that time, was on fire with debate over a FSBO at 407 PAS. I recall thinking "Wow, what a bunch of nut jobs. Those people must have a lot of time on their hands." I did not become one of the nut jobs until late summer of 2012, so when I say something predates me, what I mean is that it occurred prior to the time when I really started paying attention, which again, was end of summer 2012.

It's hard to tell who you've been watching most closely on TV: Donald Trump, or Hillary Clinton. Either way, that's great! But can I suggest, not too much with the John Kerry - I was on Streeteasy before I was on Streeteasy , doesn't sound too strong.

I don't have anything to add, except as I pulled this up, an ad asking me if I wanted to get rid of bellyfat appeared on the right side of the page. Has SE always had these ads? I realize that they may have and perhaps I had never paid attention before; maybe they had them but they just weren't always so well targeted (I actually would like to get rid of bellyfat). Whether they've always been there or not, the ad was a bit jarring, but a perfectly fair use of what is mostly blank white space to the right of the dialogues.

NYCNovice, you need to get rid of bellyfat? How much bellyfat do you need to get rid of? Do you have a plan?

Just to give credit where it's due: NWT is a far better snoop than I will ever be, and not the least bit creepy.

@w81 - NWT is the bomb, but don't sell yourself short.

MCR is now on the "watch list".