How to spot a quiet building

Grohm, a very bad experience in one apartment my husband and I rented left me with the same fears when we began searching for an apartment to buy. I did all the things that immediately come to mind when I found an apartment that we were considering making an offer on...walked by at all hours of the day and night, used the "lights on/shades up" time at dusk to try to see who lived in the apartment above ours, asked the listing agent all sorts of angular questions about why the seller was selling, etc. We decided to make an offer, it was accepted, and our attorney began her due diligence process. As part of that process, she reviewed several years worth of board minutes. We were fortunate that nothing in the minutes was redacted, so we were able to see what complaints had been made in the building (or, at least those that made it to the board level for resolution). We also attended three open houses held at this target property that were at different times on different days as yet another way to get a feel for the level of noise in the apartment. Finally, on our last visit to the apartment, we intentionally booked the showing at 7:00 pm at night, and we stood in the apartment stone silent for 15 minutes while we listened for any noise from the apartment above. We close on the apartment tomorrow, so I'll know shortly whether or not our diligence in **trying** to determine the noise level actually worked. At the end of the day, it may all be a shot in the dark...

In general, prewar construction is more solid (I suppose because cooling had to come from building thickness, not air conditioners, and because construction materials were diverted to the war effort in the 40s and then those old standards never came back) but you just have to learn the reputation of individual buildings.

Then, once you find something you like, interview the neighbors.

ali r.
{downtown broker}

This is a huge issue for me. I have had a decent experience in two post-war buildings, not so nice condo types in Chelsea, so I was relieved. But I also once had a sublet in an UES building that was buit around 1970, and was lovely with a great split level design,nice view of a green courtyard, and had walls that were so sound transparent you can hear anythng, even actual conversations almost. I think the only thing to do is what you did -- go several times.

Question for those who migth know: Aren't there some building spec contract terms that deal with thickness or soundproofness, type variables, (presumably there has to be some way of describing materials used in construction when you hire a company), and is there someway of knowing what materials precisely were used in a building. and how soundproof such materials are deemed to be???? In other words, I would think an engineer/architect/contractor type person might know some objective criteria to look at to see how big of a potential issue noise from another apartment might be. (I heard recently about someone buying in The Mill in Williamsburg who was being driven nuts by noise coming from the apartment above them, which was bad news since it was their dream home purchase).

My other issue is that ambient noise from surroundigs is usually bad, but sometimes very bad, basically anywehre in Manhattan, although New Yorkers somehow tend to delude themselves that things are quieter than they are. I have lived several years in London where, due to low density, and lack of high rises, it is incomparably quieter. For reasons of quiet I am thinking of looking along the water in Wmburg.

Has anyone living in converted brownstones encountered soundproofing issues? I wonder about floor-to-floor noise in apts built inside shells.

make absolutely sure it is not a wood frame building. you want concrete ceilings and floors. also, have your attorney pay careful attention to the board minutes re noise complaints. good luck to you, and wishing you peace and quiet.

check out The Metropolitan at 181 E 90th

that's one of the quietest buildings I have seen recently
it has built in the latest technologies to make living in NY a very quiet experience
great windows, soundproofed floors but very expensive
warning: if you check it out you may never want to buy into old buildings

All good suggestions. One very simple way to at least hedge your bets is to view the apartment in the evening. Ask for a second viewing around 7-8pm if possible. If the neighbors have kids, 7 is better. Adults only--then the later the better. These are hours when people are in the kitchen, dining, TV is on. You won't hear this stuff at a Sunday open house. It will also give you a sense of night traffic sounds which are also way different than Sunday afternoons. No matter how well you know a neighborhood, you really need to explore the traffic noise for any given apartment. Second Ave in the 70s or 80s, for example, may not seem ear-splitting when you are on the sidewalk, but 12 stories above I promise you will hear every truck and there are many of them (and you also probably aren't aware that 2nd Ave is a truck route down the UES). Cityquiet windows can deal with outside noise, but inside, read all you want, but nothing is better than visiting several times at different hours.

Thanks, HT1. That's good to know about the construction at the Metropolitan. If anyone else knows of buildings that were built to be quiet, I would appreciate learning about them.

Is it possible to somehow sound proof your apartment from your neighbors upstairs and next to you if you live in a co-op? I have heard about that from someone but he lives in a condo.

I think the worst part of the noise is when a woman is walking around in her high heels or the guy is walking around in his boots. Drives me nuts at night when I am trying to sleep.

This article on sound-proofing recently appeared in NYT. All the advice may not pertain to apartments, but still useful info:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/15/realestate/keymagazine/15keyAsk-t.html?_r=1&scp=4&sq=sound%20proofing&st=cse

I lived in a converted warehouse in FiDi a few years ago, and the noise was horrible. My hearing sucks, but it bothered my girlfriend so much, that it was the main reason we moved. We live in an old building now (early 1900's), and the walls and floors seem to be 5X as thick as the old (but, "newer") place. We've only heard our upstairs neighbor maybe 3 times in 2 years.
I would imagine most new construction in the lower price ranges are going to be loud. Any place I've ever looked at appears to have paper-thin walls, but I've never seen any expensive buildings, so I'd think that they would spend some money on soundproofing.

In both my new apartment and previous apartments (both prewar) the noise level is really low. In my previous apartment, we had one toddler living on top of us and never heard, in new apartment we have 3 kids living on top of us and as far I can tell (not living there yet) you only occasionally hear some running around. I think in general prewar are pretty solid.

if you want a quiet building, buy where most of the residents are old.