Deception By Prudential Elliman Broker Ellen Rick

If an error, how hard is it to proof your postings when you have only 5? Sloppy.

kyle, this stuff is routine for new development listings - they'll use the same stock photos for nearly every single apartment, but it's unusual to see for a co-op or condo resale. Unfortunate.

you go, kyle! at best, it is incompetent.

bjw: absolutely correct. and people looking at new development listings know they are seeing model apt photos or computer renderings. this building went up in the 1920s and has been a coop for decades. the ad copy here does not make clear the photos are of another apt.

I don't even like it for new development. Especially once construction is done.

AUGHHHH!!! HELP!!!!! ELLEN RICK!!! SEAN FELKER!!!! JIM HONEES!!!! Ty Byrd!!!!! Core Group!!! Citi Habitats!!!! All Brokers!!!! Nooooooooo

kyle- in this particular case I think it may be a streeteasy glitch. She has the two listings correctly separated on the elliman website, but I think streeteasy linked the pics from the wrong listing to her 4A listing here on this site... brokers who are not "pro" on streeteasy do not alter the listing info on the site, streeteasy pulls it directly through links from the brokers website. I think their "pull" just got done incorrectly perhaps?

In defense of the new developments, often the ads are up before the units are finished and they post the inventory off artist rendering photos. There is nothing else to show and everyone hates ads without pics.

However, they are too lazy to post real pics once things are running. THose are really annoying.

Wow,
Interesting...
After viewing the repeated evisceration of broker after broker, the condemnation of a profession and, the unfettered attack on their intelligence as a group there are still a cadre of posters that demand honesty, integrity and, professionalism.

I don't know how to break this to you but, there is no Santa.........(Me and mommy are con artists and hucksters, not to be trusted under any conditions. If we participate in the elaborate hoax where we spend our own money decorating the house and lavishing you with gifts...what won't we lie about?)

soon falco will tell me there is:
no male version of the multiple orgasm
sexy twin females never want to have a threeway with a random guy
the penthouse letters are all false
those aren't real
extendze does not work
and finally extendze for females does NOT work either!

Where is ericho to counter all this negativity!?!?

wait are you saying there is a real estate broker out there with no morality or scruples?

... A tiger? In Africa?

'wait are you saying there is a real estate broker out there with no morality or scruples? ... A tiger? In Africa?'

You have a point. Still, outing liers is useful anyway.

So kylewest, do you buy nycbrokerdax's explanation and the evidence?

can you comment here nycmatt... i'd like to see what's going on....

am I getting warm?

Regardless of what this broker has done or not done. Its poor taste to publicly disparage them. The broker is not a public figure in the same way as a politician, actor or musician is.

gcondo, I understood your post, but just so you know, tigers live in Asia, not in Africa.

Kyle: Elliman brokers seem to do this often, as I pointed out on another thread.
Photos and descriptions: "True 2 bedroom"...etc. "Wall of windows"...

The broker is dealing with the public,Riversider; so we can call them out on it.
Be honest or risk exposure; brokers.

maly: "Lions and tigers, oh my..."

Or even if not dishonest, don't be a lazy shit who shifts the work and the runaround onto the buyer ... or risk exposure.

kylewest
about 6 hours ago
ignore this person
report abuse This kind of broker schtick is just competely annoying. Look at what Elliman's Ellen Rick has done with her 2 listings at 30 Fifth Ave. The posted photos are intentionally deceptive and dishonest. She takes shots of a dining room in one (10H) and posts it in the other (4A) which doesn't even have a dining room! The living room shots in both listings are identical. The apt lines are different and the layouts completely different. This isn't the crime of the century, but it is the use of a tactic like this layered upon another upon another that ultimately add to give brokers the reputation of not being trustworthy. Shame on the broker for doing it, and shame on the sellers for tolerating it, and shame on the agency for condoning it.

kyle, you're a scumbag.

gcondo
about 4 hours ago
ignore this person
report abuse wait are you saying there is a real estate broker out there with no morality or scruples?

... A tiger? In Africa?

actually, you stupid fucking monkey, tigers live in india. if you had graduated from ELEMENTARY SCHOOL you might have learned that LIONS LIVE IN AFRICA

'sexy twin females never want to have a threeway with a random guy'

Not true? Say it ain't so.....say it!!!!

Does streeteasy pull the listings or does the broker create the listings on streeteasy? The listings seem correct on the prudential elliman site. Seems silly to purposely deceive with pictures when the link for more details shows something different.

bob, do NOT ask any question that could lead to the conclusion by w67 et. al. that the broker could be honest or even a non-player in this equation.

"gcondo, I understood your post, but just so you know, tigers live in Asia, not in Africa."

Not a Monty Python fan then? See "meaning of life". try google.

was that the fat bastard that threw up on himself.... or was that a Mel Brooks movie?

Funny, but you still haven't discussed why the mother who killed her 4 kids is ok with you, and why you were inappropriately nude around your children last year - as you expressed on streeteasy

wasn't the fat bastard, mr. creosote, who threw up on himself from monty python's the meaning of life?

every sperm is sacred, and all that. i found that movie a bit much, actually, but interesting.

county, get over yourself, like months ago.

It was suggested that the mistake could be Streeteasy's. If so, these threads should not remain without that being clarified. I wrote this to Streeteasy:
Admin: please review the listings at 30 Fifth Ave. Apt. 4A and 10H both share Apt 10H's photos. If the mistake is yours, and not Elliman's or the broker's, then the thread I started is unfair and I ask you to delete it: http://streeteasy.com/nyc/talk/discussion/21874-deception-by-prudential-elliman-broker-ellen-rick

If the mistake is yours, please post an explanation on the threads discussing the situation: http://streeteasy.com/nyc/talk/discussion/21886-kylewest-smears-somone-hes-never-met and http://streeteasy.com/nyc/talk/discussion/21872-sale-at-30-fifth-avenue-10h

Thank you.

The "Full Screen Shots" on the official Elliman.com site listing for 4A are actually the interior shots of 10H, so I'm guessing this is an elliman problem, not a streeteasy problem since streeteasy probably just pulled photos from the elliman 4A listing. However, I'm not so quick as to blame the broker - it could be a technical glitch or human error. If it actually is a bait-and-switch tactic, it certainly doesn't serve the broker or any client well - the "4A" photos (actually 10H) indicate that a lot less work needs to be done than the listing text for 4A suggests - so any buyer will be disappointed when they view 4A and see otherwise. So let's just relax, point out the issue calmly, and await a resolution.

To be honest, I think it's far more egregious that 10H is listed at $200k higher than the owner purchased it 14 months prior.

I agree with Buster's comment above--it is so likely to be a technical glitch or at the very worst just an error. In the listing she clearly says "bring your vision and your architect" which pretty clearly states that it needs a ton of work.The ugliness of this board has just gotten out of control, and nothing illustrates that more than the fact that KyleWest, of all people, always the most measured, helpful and intelligent poster around actually STARTED this awful thread--with the terrible damning title. I mean come on--the possible repurcussions of this kind of thread are SO absolutely not commensurate with what she did with the listings--even in the unlikely event that she did it purposely. I mean brokers are so reviled on this board, made out to be universally so repugnant, so evil, such slime marring the shiny shoes of the morally pristine public. And yet THIS listing seems heinous enough to start a thread like this???

Here's what I don't understand. This listing was put up and an error was made either intentionally or unintentionally. Did no one look at it after it was put up and say, hey this is wrong. Either fix it or take it down? How can this be considered a reasonable business practice?

And just 24 hours before, w67thstreet blamed brokers and the real estate industry for forcing the hand of the woman who killed her 4 children. And apt23 was right along with it.

This is a fun listing for a cute gramercy apt at Elliman Street & Prudential Way:

http://www.prudentialelliman.com/listings.aspx?listingid=1273827&utm_source=Streeteasy&utm_campaign=corporate&utm_medium=listings

The listing says it all: gtfogfllhfo uf lfljvfl

They are STILL using renderings for apts at Silver Towers. Love how they show large corner-units for studio listings!

How soon until my account will be disabled but kylewest's hasty conclusions will remain?

Everyone who knows my work knows I sell service and expertise rather than prioprietary access to information.

Yet this really does appear to be a case where the proprietary computer systems that real estate pros use are accurate, and the SE pickup/translation/entry is not.

I'm not in LIMO (the Elliman system) but I get a pickup of it through OLR, the database system I use, and in that system there are no interior photos of 4A AT ALL.

I think Ellen Rick, who I do not know, is blameless here, and would suggest to the admin that it's time for this thread to go away.

ali r.
DG Neary Realty

I've received no communications from SE today and in checking 4A's posting I see that additional photos were added today but that none were deleted as yet. 4A's post on Streeteasy continues to display the shots that are actually of 10H.

Did you go to the Elliman site yesterday before you posted?

Did you look at the Elliman site today?

Your attitude seems very casual after you've started a discussion with a screaming, defamatory headline.

Eastkyle, I looked at the elliman site today. Look at the 4A listing on the elliman site and click "Full Screen Experience" - they are actually the photos for 10H. This is the problem (and probably the source of the photos on the 4A streeteasy site), although I'm guessing it's unintentional.

http://www.prudentialelliman.com/listings.aspx?listingid=1260184

So again, Eastkyle, what are you trying to achieve?

This is probably all the fault of a summer-intern/scab at one or the other company.

Taking the easy way out I see.

The title of this thread was not: Deceptive Ad At 30 Fifth Avenue.

The title was explicitly defamatory against the individual broker, by name, and is very clearly stating this was purposeful: "Shame on the broker for doing it".

Shame on the summer-intern/scab for doing -- you know, wink wink -- it.

ali r. is a good, trustworthy R.E professional. Gives helpful advice on SE.

However, I could call out by name several who have been pulling the-bait-and-switch, misleading listings for years. I won't. We know who they are from personal experience.

The current market leaves time for buyers to check things out. And, they do; for the most part.
Buyers new to New York City, or the U.S.A. often don't know. That buyer-pool isn't what it used to be, either.

The broker named in this dicussion's title should get things clarified, herself.
If not, I would wonder why not?

Truth, completely agree. I don't know if the broker visits this site, but it would be helpful for someone involved to step up and offer an explanation. It's not a crime against humanity, but the more open we make these processes, the better for everyone.

Well bjw! You agree with me. Thanks.

Yes, the broker should visit this site. Clear her name. It won't take much to do so.

And, somewhat unrelated, but speaking of bait-and-switch, this is an excellent piece on the phenomenon (though none of the examples pertain to real estate):
http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/394/bait-and-switch

I looked at the link above: http://www.prudentialelliman.com/listings.aspx?listingid=1260184

It shows pretty clearly that the problem was not Streeteasy's which is why SE hasn't deleted the thread as I requested should the error have been found to lie with SE. For those suggesting this is a boo-boo by SE, take it back, because it clearly isn't. PrudentialElliman's own listing's full size photos for 4A contain the misleading photos from 10H. The problem that started this craziness is a product of the agent's or the agency's. We'll see if they care to correct it and if so how long that takes.

Really, so you think that the broker purposely put the correct photos in the regular listing, but then decided to put the incorrect photos, that obviously don't match the other correct ones, in the full size listing with a button right next to the correct ones? Because basically the implication is that this woman is both dishonest as well as a complete idiot.

AND, on the listing where these photos belong, and the small photos are correct, there is no full size photo set of the same photos, because of what intentional reason?

You are still so sure that this woman is intentionally deceptive and should be ashamed?

Separately, why do people assume that this broker visits streeteasy to view her listings and check to see if someone created a thread on her?

worth saying again: The title was explicitly defamatory against the individual broker, by name, and is very clearly stating this was purposeful: "Shame on the broker for doing it".

& "intentionally deceptive and dishonest"

This clearly seems like a mistake and not deception. The images are correct for 10H. The images seem correct for 4A. The full screen experience which is available on the 4A listing links back to the photos for 10H. There is no full screen experience on the listing for 10H.

Kylewest: Yes, that's right.

bob420: Nice effort, but where is the aforementioned in discussion- title broker? Why is this mistake, if it is that; still not being cleared-up by the responsible person/party?

Time now: 5:15PM, Wed. July 28th, 2010.

I think that those have suggested that this was a mistake, or an error, by the Elliman site or StreetEasy, or a combination of all are probably the closest to the truth. We've looked at it and we are confident that we have the photos which we should have. Should people be more careful when they create listings and attach photos? Hallelujah. But trust us when we say that this is nothing compared to some of the things we see. Hardly deception. We will follow-up with those involved to make sure everything is right, in the meantime, everyone breathe deep and say "shit happens".

bjw: You and I are having a detente.

If given a desert-island scenario, I would choose you over the banshee.

I would even prefer: You and somewhereelse, Riversider and w67th, and any combo of Counties.

You guys could argue over: how far the horizon, the total amount of coconuts that will fall from sun-up to sundown, count the grains of sand , chart the tides...

That would still be more pleasant than the banshee.

Gotta go -- it's time for soundcheck.

streeteasy, use language like THAT here and you'll have a whole cottage-industry of troll scolding you every night and weekend.

Time now:5:27PM, Wed. July 28th, 2010.

Kylewest: Clock-in and post the time/date, as often as possible. Keep this thread at the top of the SE discussion list. We shall see what happens.

Truth, I never really thought we were in any sort of battle here. After reading more of your posts, you seem like a good guy and have good taste in music to boot (I'm a sucker for those). I like to keep my mortal enemies on this site to 2-3 at most.

Time now: 5:41PM, Wed. July 28th, 2010.

bjw: Willie is soundchecking now. The Levon Helm Band checks next. You would enjoy it.

Now that streeteasy has said "hardly deception" I think kyle should start a thread apologizing to this broker, and let everyone know HIS real name so his work can be panned publicly.

you go first, you piece of shit.

Why? Kyle has accused someone falsely. The broker should be able to sue him. Cunt that he is.

Why? Kyle has accused someone falsely. The broker should be able to sue him. Cunt that he is.

but you're a true scumbag, through and through. self professed.

Asshole cc, not a scumbag. Scumbag is banker and lawyer territory. Which of those are you?

he's neither. But continue, oh btw, I almost did the JD/MBA combo... kick azz LSAT score, but I got tired of school and another year, I could not do.

Could you imagine, I'd been scumbag squared in your book, or is that just additive...

likely squared. but honesy likes hyperbole.

kylewest has provided enough details that his identity isn't hard to figure out with a bit of google and a bit of acris. At the end of the day, if the harmed individual wants to know who, they don't need a subpoena or any third party cooperation.

um, damages? even if you're right, what are the damages? nobody reads this, right?

hey, that's no way to treat another poster in the SE sandbox. Didn't anyone teach you how to make friends?

he was never in the sandbox. he was busy torturing small animals and frying bugs with a magnifying glass.

kylewest?

I have to say, I really enjoy the graying out of certain posters. They make for nice paragraph-like breaks in the discussions, which can feel like run-ons at times. If only we could make suggestions for a few others to be grayed out...

you can always make suggestions, bjw.

How about people who defame others without sufficient basis?

Alright. Enough. The broker/agency fixed the photos and links, likely because of the threads here,so let's move on and not keep bumping this thread.

How about we change the thread's title to Hasty Defamation by Kyle West. But we replace Kyle West with your real name.

Remember, you said it was intentional and offered no other alternative.
You used the broker's name.
In the headline.

How about standing up for what you did instead of trying to bury what you did?

if you're really interested in the apartment(s), you'll go view it/them for yourself

Plausible explanation by (possibly) the broker:
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/talk/discussion/21919-30-fifth-avenue-4a10h

At the risk of keeping this going a little longer, I still think it's weird that the outcome was wrong on Streeteasy and wrong on the Elliman sits, and perfectly correct on Online Residential.

Maybe it wasn't a boo-boo by SE (although I'm not convinced enough to "take it back") but there is one site that works off broker information where there was no deception at all. I'm still convinced the Elliman broker didn't intend to mislead anyone and is simply the victim of a tech glitch.

ali r.
DG Neary Realty

When does Kylewest get punished for intentional, false defamation?

When does trollcunty get punished for intentional, false defecation?

How would you know it is false?

kylewest: We get results. The count-down makes them move.

Truth, even more effective is the count-UP: one, twwwwooooo, twwwwooooo and a half ... you usually don't have to go beyond that. It's like magic. And then after a few applications, you'll just have to say "don't make start counting" and you get instant results. Broker management.

Alanhart: The kiddie-countdown!

kylewest, no concern that you falsely defamed someone, by name?

kylewest? Someone is harmed by your false and hasty accusations. So what have you done? You've moved on from 30 Fifth Avenue to a discussion about 40 Fifth Avenue. I still think you have unfinished business. Certainly you haven't behaved up to the standard you've tried to maintain in the past.

Cc, like you give a shit?

funny.

Yes indeed.

kylewest
2 days ago
ignore this person
report abuse This kind of broker schtick is just competely annoying. Look at what Elliman's Ellen Rick has done with her 2 listings at 30 Fifth Ave. The posted photos are intentionally deceptive and dishonest. She takes shots of a dining room in one (10H) and posts it in the other (4A) which doesn't even have a dining room! The living room shots in both listings are identical. The apt lines are different and the layouts completely different. This isn't the crime of the century, but it is the use of a tactic like this layered upon another upon another that ultimately add to give brokers the reputation of not being trustworthy. Shame on the broker for doing it, and shame on the sellers for tolerating it, and shame on the agency for condoning it.

kyle? apology? why don't you tell us who you are and what you do? maybe we could talk to some of your coworkers or your supervisor?

I'm personally disappointed in kylewest.

Frankly, his hasty decision to make this false defamatation was quite poor. But his interest in sticking with it for this length of time without a clear apology ... that reflects his real character.

What is a Troll?
An Internet troll is a person who delights in sowing discord on the Internet. He (and it is usually "he") tries to start arguments and upset people. It's ALL about "Getting Attention", and negative attention is as good as positive attention to a troll.

Trolls see Internet communications services as convenient venues for their bizarre game. For some reason, they don't get that they are hurting real people. To them, other Internet users are not quite human but are a kind of digital abstraction. As a result, they feel no sorrow whatsoever for the pain they inflict. Indeed, the greater the suffering they cause, the greater their 'achievement' (as they see it). At the moment, the relative anonymity of the net allows trolls to flourish.

Trolls are utterly impervious to criticism (constructive or otherwise). You cannot negotiate with them; you cannot cause them to feel shame or compassion; you cannot reason with them. They cannot be made to feel remorse. For some reason, trolls do not feel they are bound by the rules of courtesy or social responsibility while hiding behind the anonymity of a keyboard and monitor.

Perhaps this sounds inconceivable. You may think, Surely there is something I can write that will change them. But a true troll can not be changed by mere words.
Top

kylewest, you falsely defamed someone. We shouldn't get burined by columbiacounty. How about you acknowledge your wrongdoing and go out of your way to apologize?

"burined"? one of the things I used to notice about you was your effort for rigid control, particularly of this sort. maybe things are starting to fall apart a bit

ar, nothing worse than someone who looks for other's spelling mistakes....sad

How about impersonating someone else?

that's a question you'll have to address to someone else, cc. but take your meds first....you've near the edge..

So what'd your theory?

Are all these counties different people?

ooops.....i said "you've near the edge" ar probably got wet over that little mistake.