Opinions needed on co-op sale!

There would have to be some pretty compelling reasons why you are priced 16% higher than what you paid in 07. The listing in 07 speaks of reno'd kitchen and new stainless appliances, so from this limited info I'm afraid I don't see much value at this price. Prove me wrong, it looks like a great space!

Of course this is in addition to the most obvious issue of the eating area being down a flight of stairs from the kitchen. I gotta believe that would get awfully old in a hurry.

The entire place was gutted....it was a disaster when I bought it....It was orig listed at $600,000 but the sellers knew this place was disgusting. They were purchasing a coop and needed a contract so they didn't lose their new place so they aggresively dropped it to 550,000. I put 50,000 into it...pulled out the blue bathroom and replaced it with travertine, pedastel sink, custom shower door,New high end everything! I did the same with the half bath, ripped out the warped old wood floors and replaced it with new, put in recessed lighting with dimmers throughout, in the wall mounted speakers, moldings, paint, installed quartz a breakfast bar, put granite surrounding the fireplace,etc...the list goes on!

Do you really think it is overpriced considering that what is comporable 750 sf on the market are cookie cutter one bedrooms? Just trying to wrap my head around this screwy market!

Do you suggest that my broker add more info about the super high end reno that I did?

Thanks for your advice, btw...

There's also the breakfast bar which was not mentioned that is on the top floor next to the kitchen that has two stools and overlooks the dining/living room... I am wondering why that is not part of the description so people don't assume what you said?

I'm new to this whole selling apts in NYC too. Wow, after only a week on the market, your broker cut $36k? I see why you posted your question. Hey brokers out there, is that normal?

Well, ideally, you'll list the property correctly and competitively to begin with. Having it languish on the market, desperately dropping the price every month or so, is not a good sales plan--the listing begins to look stale, and the seller (and broker) come across as a bit clueless.

Also, it appears you're trying to flip this after having done a full reno. Major mistake these days. Custom reno work is rarely a good idea--things like travertine bathrooms and 'custom tiling' and unusual bathroom sinks are all likely going to be ripped out and redone by a buyer who doesn't share your taste. This type of highly stylized renovation for resale is never recommended, and will likely actually HURT the resale value of the property--the buyer will factor in the cost of the necessary demo and refurb when making his offer.

You also may need to do some work on the staging. Again, your idea of stylish and hip may be someone else's idea of gaudy and tacky. At the very least I'd lose the wallpaper, which makes the bedroom look low-ceiling'd and claustrophobic. The furniture isn't great, but it's serviceable (just please dump the zebra ottoman). Remember, you want buyers to picture themselves in the home; a full Maurice Villency showroom is distracting and detracting.

Bottom line--the property changed hands in 2005 for $425K. It then sold again in '07 at $549K. If you're very lucky you *may* be able to get the lower end of the '07 value for it (though this is unlikely). It will probably ultimately trade at closer to the '05 price. Either way, you're current ask is a non-starter, and should be adjusted.

valerieg - I think the renovations you did are very nice. The challenges I see with your apartment, if I was abuyer, would be:

- it is on the 2nd floor (noise, no views, not great light and people can sort of see in your apartment from the street)

- it is not a 4 room apartment. The lisiting will rub some people the wrong way. There is a kitchen, bedroom and living room...no dining room.

- it is a small apartment with some tight angles and a 2-level layout that are not going to be for everyone.

- the neighborhood is okay, but not great.

- there is no room for growth for the person that buys this apartment. Your target is likley a single person, as it would be too tight for a couple on an everyday basis and there is nowhere for a 2nd bedroom if the couple had a baby. People who buy this apartment either have to feel they are going to be in it for a long time as a single person or they have to feel they are getting a great price and will make some money on it even if it only increases a tiny bit while they are there.

I am not trying to give you a hard time, just what I would look for in an apartment. I certainly don't know everything, but I hope this was helpful in some way. Good luck with things!

Valerie, you opted not to sell on you own and to sign a contract with a broker. The assumption is that you interviewed multiple brokers and assessed their experence and comparables and advice. The question is why are you asking anonymous posters to weigh in on your and your broker's decision(s)?

Since you asked for guidance, my advice to you is to fall silent.

>>Do you suggest that my broker add more info about the super high end reno that I did?<<

NO! That will turn off many buyers. Who advised you to do this 'super high-end reno' anyway? Bad, bad choice for a flip.

screwy market is right! I don't know enough about the area, but location is a big deal and there is lots of competition in prime areas right now. I think your write-up is fine and captures everything -except timeline. I would inject something about when the gut was done so people don't assume you are riding the coattails of a two year old reno that was already priced in when you bought.

I am a BIG fan of unique spaces and thoughtful, high quality renovations and yours looks great. I also believe there are more and more people out there looking to break the cookie cutter mold, so you may find someone who HAS to have it. But if you need to sell, you also need to be realistic and understand that you fell into an unfortunate confluence of market events that are working against you. The market will give you your price soon enough. Encourage offers and don't get offended if they are lower than you expected. Engage the potential buyers with counters. Sometimes I think agents in NY have been spoiled and have lost the art of negotiation -oh they can negotiate bidding wars just fine... but we are on the opposite end of the spectrum today. GOOD LUCK!!

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/406710-coop-160-east-26th-street-kips-bay-new-york

You're competing with 5B, priced at $499k. It looks a little smaller but appears to get better light, and higher floors tend to go for more. I'm not a broker, but I think this price is pretty aspirational. It's a nice place, but monthly carrying costs are $3,620 assuming 20% down. You can rent a mighty fine 1- or 2-bedroom apartment almost anywhere in the city for less than that these days.

Thanks for the advice....the pics that are posted on here, unfortunately are not the ones that were taken for the brokers website and NYtimes listing...the prof photographer came and removed my "personal touches" on the place which I agree is the best way to show the apartment. The apartment is on the second floor so it is not super sunny all day but I do get really good light, surprisingly. The noise is never an issue. The building faces the back so I never hear a thing!

It is NOT a flip. I lived here for two years and put a lot of money into it thinking I would stay...and put a lot of personal touches in it for that reason.

Also, in December the unit 2 doors down...similar square footage but less desireable layout sold at ask for 569,000. It was UNRENOVATED...parquet floors, old white applliances, bathrooms falling apart with cracked tile.

Apartment 5B is 600 sf with 1 bath and a lofted bedroom without a door. My apartment is 750 sf with the extra half bath and a full bedroom with the door and en suite bath.

I find it odd that this is listed as a 4 room apartment -- I only see 3 rooms.

ali r.
{downtown broker}

Well, hopefully you'll prove me wrong. But remember, unrenovated space can be of greater value to a buyer who wants a clean slate for his own ideas. Having to demolish and start over is a huge turn-off. Of course, you may find someone who absolutely loves your style and is happy to move right in. Hopefully that will be the case. If not, expect to have to sell for lower than you'd like.

One thing I didn't notice before-- the maintenance is rather high for a non-doorman building. That will need to be factored in to the price as well.

You know, I always find it a little weird when people post their apartments on this board seeking advice and then proceed to get super defensive when posters give honest opinions.

I think it would be unbelieveably hard to do a FSBO so I chose a reputable broker that I believed could sell it for me...I do trust her- I just was hoping for some friendly feedback and that brought me here.

Not defensive at all! I don't know why you said that?? I appreciate the feedback! I am just trying to explain the differences in apartments....

evnyc - weird to seek advice? weird to support the pricing with additional detailed information? and I don't see her being "super defensive" either.

I only started this discussion to see what my peers thought....I am not that person to just sit on the sidlines with my head in the sand. I do want to have a part of this process because as much as I trust someone to sell this, it ultimately is my home and my money and would like to gather as much information as possible and figure out what's best. Thank you again for all weighing in.

Of course it isn't weird to seek advice. It's just weird to start dismissing the sought-after opinions when they don't seem to support the OP's objective. An exercise in futility.

You are very brave to open this conversation.

I was not dismissing anything! I already emailed my broker and asked her to add the breakfast bar to the listing because I didn't want people to assume that to eat you needed to walk down a flight of stairs. I will also make sure I try to take out as many personal touches as I can before the open house thanks to this.

My place is in a totally different neighb, but I decided to postpone listing until fall. I was told that all offers coming in now are still lowball--the people who are looking are looking for steals.

Just to prepare you for what may be coming in.

Devil's advocate, Valerie: How do you know anonymous posters are your peers? :)

You may also ask your broker to tweak the floorplan--Ali makes a good point that there are definitely do not appear to be 4 rooms; if that's the case, it is a misrepresentation to claim so. Also, the dining 'room' should actually be listed as a dining area.

These things might sound nit-picky, but buyers can easily get irked when things appear 'misrepresented'--you want to entice them to come see the place, not hit the back button in a huff.

ok so this was a bad idea...seriously? play devils advocate? Whatever you would like to call it peers not peers...

I will def ask my broker why she liststed it as 4 rooms -good point

The lighting in the photos are very poor. Makes the place appear drab. Re-take some photos during peak light or with professional lighting.

valerieg,

I need to say this now as a warning, so please read the following carefully. While your post may have started out innocently, things will very soon turn nasty. If you dont believe me feel free to read up on the whole 407PAS debacle. That guy came in just as you did, asking for advice. People on this board are going to TEAR your apartment into pieces, as you likely have already noticed. Whats going to happen is you will end up arguing with 3 or 4 people who disagree with your listing, or how the photos look, or comps, or something. The next thing you know there will be 15 or more people jumping on this and giving your apartment so VERY BAD publicity.

My advice to you is check out the 407PAS thread to see what is without a doubt going to happen here. I strongly suggest you not post A SINGLE other response here, and simply walk away. You have come to the WRONG place to get objective advice (that you want to hear at least) about your property. You might honestly want to ask SE admin to pull this listing before things get out of control. I am really looking out for you here, so I sincerely hope you heed my advice........

The pics on here were my orig pics before the prof photog came. The new ones are on the brokers sight and the nytimes...for some reason these were not updated as well

>>I will def ask my broker why she liststed it as 4 rooms -good point<<

It's a common ploy by brokers to fudge things a bit in an effort to net a wider pool of searches.

>>The next thing you know there will be 15 or more people jumping on this and giving your apartment so VERY BAD publicity.<<

Publicity is publicity, whether good or 'bad'. Valerie has had more hits on her listing today than could ever happen through standard marketing alone. IMO, very savvy salesmanship on Valerie's part.

Yeah, I'm with UESBandit. With my posts, I was trying to be helpful as a future fellow seller, but I don't know how happy your broker will be seeing people's comments (and my sense is that brokers check this site out--they do pay to list on it, after all). I'd ask SE to pull this discussion thread.

Publicity is publicity, whether good or 'bad'. Valerie has had more hits on her listing today than could ever happen through standard marketing alone. IMO, very savvy salesmanship on Valerie's part.

Would you say the same thing about 407PAS's lising?? For those who dont know, the New York Times real estate section (either last weekend or the weekend before) had a FRONT PAGE article about a certain listing that was TORN APART here on SE. Anyone care to guess what it was?? Hint, it was a FSBO listing that many of you chimed in on. ValerieG is a big girl, and she can do as she pleases here. I was offering honest advice, and what she chooses to do with it is up to her. I again state very clearly that this listing is soon to turn VERY NEGATIVE, lets watch and see what happens...

People on the board did treat 407PAS very badly, which was a shame. That said, they mostly turned out to be correct: he had overpriced the place and has had to reduce the price a couple of times. Last I heard it still hadn't sold. No one here is trying to be nasty, least of all me. If I came off that way, I sincerely apologize. But there's a big difference between seeking "friendly" advice, which I interpret as desiring to hear nice things about your property, and honest advice, which is what you are likely to find on this board.

The lighting on the Corcoran site is better, but this still doesn't seem like particularly good light to me. http://www.corcoran.com/property/listing.aspx?Region=NYC&listingid=1497036

As a potential buyer in this price range, I would personally prefer the slightly smaller space with better light several floors higher for over $100k less. That is all I am saying.

Squid: excellent point.

UESBandit has good advice for you. Take what you need and run with it. This sort of thread ends up being useful for about an hour and then it gets sucked into a black hole.

"As a potential buyer in this price range, I would personally prefer the slightly smaller space with better light several floors higher for over $100k less."

ValeriG; here we go, hold on for the bumpy ride! The SE admin is just an email away, request he pull this NOW before its too late. This will be my last post regarding this topic here, so be warned.

Calling it a "triplex" is a flat-out lie. There aren't "three levels", as the description on Corcoran's website says. It has a sunken bedroom. Calling that its on "level" would mean that every apartment with a sunken living room in this city is a "duplex".

Right off the bat, you've turned me off, and I wouldn't want to do business with your brokers.

What, we're suddenly not supposed to offer opinions?

Ive asked them to pull the thread. Thanks everyone for all the advice.

I don't think you get to pull a thread when you stop liking its contents. Nothing stated here is inappropriate. The comments are responsive to the original post. If this gets pulled, I really do not understand the site's editorial policies.

Gotta agree with Kyle here.

Why is everyone assuming that 'valerieg' is indeed the owner of the apartment that is being discussed? Anybody can pretend to be.

If not the owner, why would person want thread pulled? In any event, a public board can't be fact-checked and policed to the extent that the representations of every poster are vetted and verified. This is a legitimate discussion of a property for sale. I think the thread has run its course in any event and sort of demonstrated that just because a property is discussed (contrary to the NYT suggestions) is does not necessarily just get gratuitously bashed.

Agreed.

I wasn't bashing the apartment per se, but rather the deceitful description by the listing agents.

Did 'valerieg' really want this thread pulled? You don't know that.

It's a cute pad with a nice reno that needs a modified price. GLWS.

Perhaps Spinnaker 1 is spot on --- we've reached the event horizon.

I actually think this poster got some good feedback on her place (if it is, in fact, her place). The thread has probably run its usefulness out, but denouncing it as 'bashing' her place is a little strong.

It's a tough market and people on this site are anonymous, but they're also interested in real estate and have offered some honest critiques. As you say, UESBandit, valerie is a big girl. She should be able to sort through what's useful to her and what's not.

valerieg,

1) When I don't see the bathroom in a listing, I assume that it's unrenovated or hideous. If the bathrooms are renovated as you say, you should add bathroom photos to your listing.

2) Don't try to pass this off as a 750 sq ft apartment. The BR is 132 sq ft, the LR is 207.5 sq ft, and the kitchen is 53.4 sq ft, which add up to 393.4 sq ft. Even if the bathrooms added up to 100 sq ft, the apartment is still around 500 square feet; 550 sq ft TOPS. I did not even have to do the calculation to figure out that the the square footage is overstated; I could tell by the tight fit of the furniture that it would be a very narrow apartment. I am not trying to be mean, and am willing to be convinced if you have a cogent argument as to where the other 200+ sq ft can be found.

Agree with Jerkstore that it's a cute apartment but the price would have to come way down for it to move, particularly with maintenance @ ~$2/sq ft.

OnTheMove, are you really surprised the agents are -- ahem -- stretching the truth about the square footage? They're calling it a "triplex"!

This shouldn't be pulled, since there isn't anything inappropriate in it. 407 got dinged around because he became very defensive and just made things worse and worse for himself.

This isn't a bad apartment. It just needs to lower the price and come clean with the triplex, 4 rooms, square footage issues. Those are the broker's faults, so this would/should be helpful for valerieg.

Another pet peeve of mine is how agents calculate room dimensions. If you're going to list "living room" and "dining room" separately on the floor plan, do not include the length of the dining room when trying to boost the dimensions of the "living room". In this case, they say the "living room" is 20 feet long, when clearly 10 feet of that is occupied by the dining room table.

"Triplex" is, to me, a turnoff anyway. "Duplex" indicates (usually, not here) an elegant separation of public and private rooms. "Triplex" reads like "Stairmaster".

Will there be warm cookies at the open houses? Will I have to climb stairs to get them?

Waverly, well put. It's not a bad apartment at all. It just has a lot of competition. We're not in the "stick a price tag on it and wait for the bidding war to commence" era any more, and a misleading listing could hurt the sale.

I gotta stop posting and get some work done.

"super high end reno that I did? "

I think you should get your own broker's license; you're half way there already.

i say final sales price of $575