West 67th Street - Per Square foot pricing

w67th is one of the best posters on this board; as far as the street goes, that's debatable

I used to live on West 67th (Toulaine between Broadway and Amsterdam) and it is a great street. It deadends at Amsterdam so it gets much less traffic than other streets that run all the way through.

My $0.02 is (and probably worth what you are paying for it) is:
- There has been a downturn everywhere (and while that area is very convenient and lovely ... it is also Little Jersey surrounded by mall stores ... it is great and I love it - but Fifth, Park or West Village it is not!)
- 25% off is very reasonable - doesn't mean that the sellers would accept it but it is absolutely reasonable. You have to decide if you want to risk not buying it and they have to decide if they want to risk losing you. I also think it is overpriced for the floor ... which brings me to ...
- I would think long and hard about buying a 2nd floor apartment anywhere at anything but a REALLY significant discount. The market is weak, it may not come back for a really long time - why buy anything that has such a clear potential resale issue? I saw first floor apartments linger in the boom years ... they aren't gonna fly off the shelves in the downturn.

I think $1,000 sq foot is overpriced for a 2nd floor apt right now.

Good luck!

A 25% discount on 2A is aggressive but within reason given floor and condition. But man, is it really worth the hassle and cost of a reno, when there is one done already? If the seller doesn't even want to engage in discussion, thank them kindly and head up to 7A and see if they'll deal. The high water mark is obviously 5A, which went in 18 days for 1.3M at the peak. 7A is now 15% below that but its still priced the same as recent sale of a G line 2 BR. There is plenty of comp data here to justify a realistic bid. W67th is surrounded by a bit of madness but for some that's a plus.

Most of the park blocks on the UWS are very charming. W67th is thought to be a great block because of the lack of traffic, and the many "artist studio" buildings on the street. You can google and find out some interesting factoids about the artist studios. OTOH, it is not a low-rise bstone block (like 69th, or 70th or 71st). 40, 50 W67th have some of the highest recorded non-lux, non-condo, non-FS prices/sqft on the UWS. I can't say whether this gap will narrow with current economic conditions.

My bottom line: unless you have fallen in love with this unit and have to have it, better apts will come on the market in the next 12 months at lower prices.

Terrible situation for the listing agent: property went to contract last fall, almost certainly north of $1MM. That deal fell through, and now the seller is anchored to that price - hence, no cuts since January. Clearly, the ask is too high, and the broker must know it after four+ months of languishing at the same price. If you are a well-qualified buyer and make a half-way reasonable bid, I bet the broker will work hard for you to get the deal done.

W81: Any thoughts on why 40/50 have commanded such sky-high prices in the past? Is it mostly the beauty of the buildings & the niceness of block?

its a nice large apartment but bottom line it's still a one bedroom. i think it's overpriced - you can get a 2 bed for that price on the uws.

I've seen a back apartment in 40, the one with the big leaded-glass windows. Felt bigger than the plans and pictures indicate. Also saw a GH combo in 50 (not the one in the SE plans) that I fell for, but it was twice our budget. Hard to explain the cachet of the block and lots of its buildings, but I see why people pay for it.

Wow--great comments. I think NY is going through the growing pains of the real estate downturn still (we're two years into it here in California--and only now are things starting to move again). I was responding to the fixer, as I liked the idea of being able to make the place "new". I still have one question though--are comps "building related", "street related" or Both? Thanks,

Both - building related comps are most accurate, of course. But street and nabe comps are useful, because many would argue that at the ht of the bubble, the gap between the average & the best properties widened. These buildings on 67th were viewed as very good buildings, so one could argue that the price differential should shrink in a less heated market.

ONE LAST QUESTION (and the following quote is from the TheRealDeal website):

Residential apartment buyers want prices to be nearly one-third off the market's high mark to convince them to go into contract, Pamela Liebman, CEO of the Corcoran Group said at a panel discussion yesterday.

"My brokers are telling me, 'The way I am making deals right now is if I can prove to the buyer that this apartment [is] actually selling for 30 percent less than it sold at the height of the market,'" she said.

MY QUESTION IS THIS: What is considered the height of the market? 4th Quarter '07? Sometime in 08?

Also--if 20-30% off peak pricing is what apartments are going for right now, should one look at (comps) prices back to '06? Maybe the middle of "05?

Thanks,

I think it's nonsensical to derive market prices by applying a simple 30% off peak formula. What you should really ask yourself is what is the price point at which there will be at least one buyer for this apt. To answer this question, you should look at what prices comparable apts are getting sold at today. I think buyers for a 1m 1-bedroom apt are thin on the ground, even for this location. Are 1-beds on the UWS getting sold at 500k, 600k? You should look for examples.

Rent for a year and see where the dust settles.

The market ain't gonna run away from you!

Comps are difficult these days because the volume is still quite low. I wouldn't put too much weight in them anyway ... the ultimate question is: what are you comfortable paying? That is what you should bid for any apartment. If you get it, great - it was a match. If not, keep looking. So many people bought outside their own price range because they thought they had to ... now they are stuck in homes that they could never afford in the first place. Don't let the market dictate what you feel comfortable paying and eventually you will find a fit. Good luck!

I'm curious why people consider w. 67th to be such a nice block. I park on w. 66 and when I walk down that way, I always feel the further down I get on Broadway or Columbus, the more touristy, crowded and "mall-like" it gets. Is that just me? I much prefer the high 70's low 80's - they are a little grittier I suppose but I'm not that into the polish personally. Proximity to Reebok is obviously a huge plus.

But what if Calif is worth 100m+? He/she might be comfortable paying 1m but only if it's in line with prevailing market prices. I don't really understand the idea of only looking at what you're comfortable paying.

OT: W67-71 bet. Col. & CPW are nice, as are 73-77 park blocks, 78 bet. Ams. & Col. The issue is housing stock. The rental stock is generally not well-maintained and there just isn't that much product in the 1-2bedroom range. If you want an elevator, doorman building with some arch. pedigree, W67 is your best bet.

There are other 1bed in prewar buildings in the vicinity - a couple on 69th, 68th, 71st. Further north, there's really not very much in elevatored buildings.

nyc10023 - Lets assume ... for the sake of argument and also with statistics on our side ... that Calif is not worth $100m and making an investment in a home is actually a very critical decision for her financial health.

"I don't really understand the idea of only looking at what you're comfortable paying." Well, I guess if window shopping is fun for you, cool. But most people have neither the time nor the inclination to look above what they are comfortable with and can afford. At best, its a waste of time. At worst, it makes them wish they could afford more and be tempted to reach, which is a very bad idea.

There are plenty of elevator buildings further north on the UWS. OTNYC points out that the neighborhoods further north have more charm, independent businesses, etc. That is correct. I personally prefer the 60s as its an easy walk to midtown but I stand by my original comment - its Little Jersey.

You misunderstand my point. Even if Calif is not a hundred-millionaire, what if he/she is comfortable paying more than the prevailing market price? But why should he/she pay that much?

There are not a lot of charming elevatored buildings on park blocks in the 70s or 80s or 60s with 1 bedrooms for sale. By charming, I mean architectural charm. I think that's why W67 gets a bit of premium due to the large # of old artist studio co-ops.

Not a hundred millionaire here, but doing well enough to be able to buy a place in Manhattan. Excellent thoughts everyone. I will be patient as I want to find the "right place" for the money. I've waited 6 months, what's another, yes?

If you hear of any great pre-wars in the Lincoln square area (maybe the low 80's tops), send them my way.... I will keep everyone apprised. I can't tell you how much I appreciate everyone's candor....Very, very helpful...

Calif,

In case you wern't aware, fixing up a place in historic district UWS is very different than fixing a place in Cali (ie you cannot hire folks from the home depot parking lot). Make sure you are aware of potential costs,headaches,red-tape if u go with a fixer...

VERY AWARE of the the renovation differences (costs, headaches, approvals, parking tickets, paying the super, etc.) --we have family and friends that have gone through it--it's quite a different project in NYC compared to elsewhere...

columbiacounty... man chest thump out to you.... TRUE SE MAN LOVE!

nyc10023... I never really thought much about the no thru fare.... nice pick up ....