Successful Lowballs

For comparison with a same-vintage "good" building, see http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/429017-coop-150-east-69th-street-lenox-hill-new-york at Imperial House. Better space for $100K more, but $1K less maintenance, and you could say Lex and 69th beats Fifth and 89th for location.

Good points about views, prestige, ceiling height and post-war. I disagree about size, though - this is bigger than the vast majority of classic six floorplans I've seen. Still very surprised about psf for 5th, even with all the negatives you list.

this could go in so many threads. sponsor sale, building largely sold out it seems. $900 psf for new construction, 3/3.5, unit 14B. nice building and layout, challenging location. good family apartment. 16B sold at list, $2,850,000 04/08, sponsor also unloaded 17B for $2,150,000 in 12/08, a better result for the seller at $1150 psf. sometimes it pays to wait.

http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/73672-condo-450-east-83rd-street-yorkville-new-york
03/22/2007Listed by Corcoran at $2,810,000.
10/29/2007Listing is no longer available.
03/04/2008Re-listed by Corcoran.
10/01/2008Listing is no longer available.
01/07/2010Sale recorded for $1,679,400.

40% below ask...now thats inspiring

Aboutready: That Cielo trade is a real eye-opener. 83rd and York isn't a bad spot, especially on a high floor. The trade looks legit - can't see any reason to suspect it wasn't arm's-length. It's possible that early sales might have been juiced to create strong comps. $2.85MM for #16B seems nutty even by bubble standards.

Shifting west to the edge of prime UES:
205 East 78th Street #20-C. Pre-war 2/2 with dining alcove, open views and redone kitchen/baths. Maintenance of $2,353 reflects the high floor. Closed 15.3% below last ask.
10/17/2008 Listed by RP Miller at $1,095,000.
12/03/2008 Listing is no longer available.
02/20/2009 Re-listed by RP Miller.
07/08/2009 Price decreased by 4% to $1,049,000.
10/25/2009 Price decreased by 3% to $1,015,000.
11/18/2009 Listing is no longer available.
02/10/2010 Sale recorded for $860,000.

45 East 89th Street #35C: 2BR/2BA condop (with potential third BR) converted to a trophy 1BR with huge living space and spectacular park views.
09/03/2009 Listed by Brown Harris Stevens at $2,400,000.
10/21/2009 Price decreased by 8% to $2,200,000.
01/04/2010 Listing entered contract.
02/10/2010 Sale recorded for $1,800,000.
The comps are a bit tricky, but $1.8MM looks 2004-ish.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/451024-condop-45-east-89th-street-carnegie-hill-new-york

w81st, the cielo is interesting. and shows what timing and lack of competition can do for you. the neighborhood is very appealing to a certain group, particularly families. there was relatively little new product available nearby. if you look at the selling history, carlisle didn't close units overwhelmingly quickly. but they were very determined to get top dollar, and luckily for them they had closed most of the units prior to the financial disaster. early, slow and steady won the race for this development. at what seemed to me at the time to be a remarkably high ppsf.

but if you've paid off your loans, made your profit, you might want to unload the last few.

151 East 58th Street #37B: After re-signing with the Angels, Bobby Abreu seems to be clearing out his New York holdings. Still a decent profit over his basis.
04/05/2005 Previous Sale recorded for $3,800,000.
05/07/2008 Previously Listed by Century 21 NY Metro at $7,900,000.
12/22/2008 Century 21 NY Metro Listing is no longer available.
04/28/2009 Listed by Prudential Elliman at $7,900,000.
05/04/2009 Listing is no longer available.
05/17/2009 Re-listed by Prudential Elliman.
05/17/2009 Price decreased by 13% to $6,900,000.
08/25/2009 Price decreased by 14% to $5,900,000.
12/04/2009 Listing entered contract.
02/12/2010 Sale recorded for $5,100,000.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/407341-condo-151-east-58th-street-midtown-new-york
Another Midtown East condo owned by Abreu is faring less well:
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/396532-condo-sutton-area-sutton-place-new-york

there's a lot of interesting stuff in recorded sales right now. here's a good lowball, new development. 3/3.5, just under 2000sf. the 90 recorded sales have averaged $1815 psf. this is the second floor, but still.

http://www.streeteasy.com/
11/11/2009Listed by Corcoran at $3,350,000.
01/08/2010Listing entered contract.
02/23/2010Sale recorded for $2,350,000.

where is this place, aboutready?

oops. sorry.

http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/478142-condo-170-east-end-avenue-yorkville-new-york

Nice lowball catches on 170WEA and 450E83. We should start a thread for good potential lowball listings - listings that have lingered on the market for a long time. There was a price chops thread but I don't know where it went.

322 East 57th Street #14/15B: Natural duplex with double-height LR, in an all-cash, pre-war coop with a bold-face shareholder list. Fairly quick estate sale, 18% below ask.
09/12/2009 Listed by Brown Harris Stevens at $3,900,000.
12/24/2009 Listing entered contract.
03/05/2010 Sale recorded for $3,200,000.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/462190-coop-322-east-57th-street-sutton-place-new-york

i can't opine as to whether or not this was a good deal, but it just closed for $425,000, making it indeed a lowball, and quite a chopper as well.

http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/366528-multi-21-west-120th-street-central-harlem-new-york

11/20/2008Listed by Halstead Property at $995,000.
02/13/2009Price decreased by 10% to $895,000.
05/07/2009Price decreased by 22% to $695,000.
05/20/2009Listing is no longer available.
06/02/2009Re-listed by Halstead Property.
07/10/2009Listing is no longer available.
08/13/2009Re-listed by Halstead Property.
09/15/2009Listing sold.
11/04/2009Re-listed by Halstead Property.
01/29/2010Listing entered contract.
03/04/2010Listing sold.

101 Central Park West #5B (previously listed as #5-B): Sprawling park-view corner nine closed 36% below original ask and 14% below final ask.
08/29/2008 Listed by CBHK at $10,600,000.
10/15/2008 Price decreased by 8% to $9,800,000.
02/26/2009 Price decreased by 9% to $8,900,000.
04/04/2009 Listing is no longer available.
04/11/2009 Listed by Stribling at $8,750,000.
06/11/2009 Price decreased by 7% to $8,100,000.
08/12/2009 Price decreased by 2% to $7,900,000.
12/02/2009 Listing entered contract.
03/02/2010 Sale recorded for $6,800,000.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/building/101-central-park-west-new_york

1025 Fifth

09/12/2009Listed by Corcoran at $2,450,000.
12/03/2009Listing entered contract.
03/10/2010Listing sold.
03/10/2010Sale recorded for $1,975,000

19%+ below ask.

http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/462138-coop-1025-fifth-avenue-upper-east-side-new-york?email=true

I am kind of shocked. I thought the ask was surprisingly reasonable for the size and location, and now a sale so far below ask. Wow.

166 Perry Street #PH (a.k.a. #PHE-W): Trippy new 6,845 ft² penthouse. Closed 38.2% below ask.
05/10/2008 Listed by Corcoran at $24,000,000.
11/26/2009 Listing entered contract.
03/16/2010 Sale recorded for $14,825,720
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/building/166-perry-street-new_york

Continuing with 166 Perry St.: 4B closed 27.2% below ask.
10/21/2009 Listed by Corcoran at $2,875,000.
11/07/2009 Listing entered contract.
03/19/2010 Sale recorded for $2,093,934.

Glad to see the lowball is alive and well.

05/01/2009Listed by Charles Rutenberg at $1,850,000.
07/02/2009Price decreased by 19% to $1,495,000.
09/30/2009Listing is no longer available.
10/26/2009Re-listed by Charles Rutenberg.
10/28/2009Price increased by 7% to $1,595,000.
03/22/2010Listing sold.
03/22/2010Sale recorded for $1,300,000

18.5% off last ask.

http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/408042-coop-103-east-84th-street-upper-east-side-new-york

Wow. Second floor, but $1.3 is a great price (from a buyer's perspective) for a 3BR in PS6.

it will be interesting to see what the other apartment in this line ultimately sells for....currently asking $1,895,000.

2/2.5 with not-bad maintenance considering building and location, at a 17.5% listing discount: http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/481555-coop-1-east-66th-street-lenox-hill-new-york

02/25/2008 Previously Listed by Edward Lee Cave at $3,150,000.
12/19/2008 Edward Lee Cave Listing is no longer available.
12/01/2009 Listed in StreetEasy, already in contract, by Brown Harris Stevens at $3,150,000.
03/26/2010 Sale recorded for $2,600,000.

#78F upstairs tried to get $3.2M, then $2.8M, in 2008, but gave up.

40 Broad Street (Setai) #26H: 1,149 ft², can be configured as a one- or two-BR. Closed 43.4% below ask.
10/05/2009 Listed by Setai Sales Center (The Marketing Directors) at $1,900,000.
02/11/2010 Listing entered contract.
04/29/2010 Sale recorded for $1,075,201.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/closing/1009588
The investor-buyer picked up the adjacent 1BR as well:
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/closing/1009617
Even at these prices, it's not clear that Setai is a winning proposition for investors. Both apartments have been listed for rent since shortly after they went to contract, and the asking rents hae already been reduced.

Here are the rental listings for #26H and and #26G, respectively:
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/rental/626441-condo-40-broad-street-financial-district-new-york
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/rental/626442-condo-40-broad-street-financial-district-new-york

ok > 200 posts....does anyone have a decision on what the greatest low ball was?

I bought a doorman studio in 1994 for $400, rent-stabilized with positive cash flow. Seller was the
FDIC as Receiver. The FDIC had a non-performing loan of $65,000 on the apartment, and paid $825 in fees
to transfer its title to me. I wish I could find other shrewd businessmen like them.

840 Park Avenue #9B: Roomy estate seven, sold quickly 13.7% below ask.
01/15/2010 Listed by Prudential Elliman at $3,650,000.
03/16/2010 Listing entered contract.
05/05/2010 Sale recorded for $3,150,000.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/489300-coop-840-park-avenue-upper-east-side-new-york

133 East 64th Street Penthouse: Closed 11.25% below final ask, a footnote to one of the great scams of all time.
09/12/2009 Listed by Sotheby's International Realty, Inc. at $9,900,000.
11/09/2009 Price decreased by 10% to $8,900,000.
02/21/2010 Listing entered contract.
05/05/2010 Sale recorded for $8,000,000.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/462064-coop-133-east-64th-street-lenox-hill-new-york

http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/490794-coop-335-greenwich-street-tribeca-new-york

Listed for 1.5mm, sold for 1mm. In prime Tribeca. Even with the need for a gut renov, that seems like a major drop. What am i missing??

renovated condo studio. 5E sold for $375k 02/09 (and is now back on the market asking $540k, post-renovation).

http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/268828-condo-151-east-20th-street-gramercy-park-new-york

07/02/2007Previously Listed by Corcoran at $550,000.
08/05/2007Corcoran Listing is no longer available. Last priced at $499,000.
05/31/2008Listed by Citi-Habitats at $515,000.
08/04/2008Price decreased by 3% to $499,000.
08/29/2008Price increased by 3% to $515,000.
11/25/2008Listing is no longer available.
05/14/2010Sale recorded for $310,000.

535 West End Avenue #11: The first closed sale of a full-floor apartment at 535 WEA seems to answer the question of whether the pricing here was realistic.
05/01/2008 Listed by Corcoran at $21,500,000.
10/18/2008 Price decreased by 14% to $18,500,000.
11/14/2008 Price increased by 16% to $21,500,000.
11/14/2008 Listing entered contract.
05/25/2010 Listing is no longer available.
05/25/2010 Sale recorded for $12,907,846.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/228375-condo-535-west-end-avenue-upper-west-side-new-york

Nice catch W81. NWT, want to weigh in on weather they can make a profit at 40% off?

If they'd sold everything at the $-per-PCI they got for 6B and 7B, the gross would've been $270-odd million. At the 11th-floor rate, something like $220 million. Mortgage is $135 million, and we don't know how much cash Extell put into it, but they should do OK unless the sky falls in.

Thx. Interesting. Guess their land costs weren't too bad.

AR, your example of a very small renovated studio selling for $1000 psf may be a deep discount from asking, but hardly unexpected in todays market. Most people on this board think an alcove studio is a lousy investment, and your example is considerably less practical. I would maybe pay $750 psf on a good day.

well, pmg, you're not the market, now are you? there has been a floor below which even the smallest of studios have not gone below, if in a decent neighborhood. almost like any given space is worth at least X, with prices increasing from there.

if you read the first sentence, you'll notice that one of my points is that it is over 20% below a comp which occurred post-lehman. not whether or not i or you would buy it.

thanks for playing.

my numbers were off. a bit less than 20% off a post-lehman comp.

720 Park Avenue #4A: 20% off ask, showing that bold-face names at bold-face addresses can disregard an inflated asking price as well as the rest of us.
11/11/2008 Listed by Brown Harris Stevens at $33,000,000.
04/07/2009 Price decreased by 12% to $29,000,000.
05/19/2009 Delisted temporarily.
09/08/2009 Re-listed by Brown Harris Stevens.
09/08/2009 Price decreased by 5% to $27,500,000.
03/19/2010 Listing is no longer available.
05/24/2010 Sale recorded for $21,995,500.

Funny, a year ago her sister-in-law paid $29,000,000 at 834 Fifth. Wait a year, save $7,000,000. Not that the two places were comparable, except in price.

http://streeteasy.com/nyc/closing/958706 --- $14 million to #6 and change...

Am I reading this right?

300 East 54th 31BCDF.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/385757-coop-300-east-54th-street-sutton-place-new-york

02/19/2009 Listed by Prudential Elliman at $3,900,000.
03/18/2009 Price decreased by 4% to $3,750,000.
04/14/2009 Price decreased by 7% to $3,500,000.
05/05/2009 Price decreased by 6% to $3,300,000.
06/02/2009 Price decreased by 12% to $2,895,000.
06/30/2009 Price decreased by 3% to $2,795,000.
10/06/2009 Price decreased by 11% to $2,500,000.
02/24/2010 Listing entered contract.
05/28/2010 Listing is no longer available.

I see a closing for 31BCD for $1.9MM. I don't see a separate closing for F, so does that mean the whole thing went for $1.9MM? That would be a very respectable 24% off in February of 2010.

Not to mention A LOT of space for that price (recognizing that the place was a total wreck, and there are other negatives as well, but still).

Yes, the whole BCDF thing, or so the buyer's UCC1 says.

505 West End Avenue #3B: Estate six, closed 12.3% below final ask.
10/31/2008 Previously Listed by Corcoran at $1,749,000.
04/19/2009 Corcoran Listing is no longer available. Last priced at $1,699,000.
04/09/2010 Listed in StreetEasy, already in contract, by Corcoran at $1,699,000.
07/14/2010 Listing is no longer available.
07/14/2010 Sale recorded for $1,490,000.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/510558-coop-505-west-end-avenue-upper-west-side-new-york

1 West 72nd (Dakota) #77: Closed 10% below ask.
11/14/2008 Listed by Prudential Elliman at $14,500,000.
06/30/2010 Sale recorded for $13,000,000.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/365544-coop-1-west-72nd-street-upper-west-side-new-york

81st - I'll invite you and the fam over once I finish painting.

Spin: Looking forward to it. Thx.

sponsor sale, pre-war walk up. fha approved. dramatic chop. very, very small 2/1.

http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/475020-condo-63-west-107th-street-manhattan-valley-new-york
10/29/2009Listed by Prudential Elliman at $520,000.
05/17/2010Sale recorded for $283,920.
05/18/2010Listing entered contract.
05/26/2010Listing is no longer available.

141 East 72nd Street #8FL. Full-floor twelve-into-nine pre-war coop.
02/05/2010 Listed by Corcoran at $5,700,000.
03/18/2010 Price decreased by 15% to $4,850,000.
05/10/2010 Listing entered contract.
07/21/2010 Sale recorded for $4,318,275
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/494528-coop-141-east-72nd-street-upper-east-side-new-york

The odd closing price looks like $4,192,500 plus the 3% flip tax, so the apartment sold either 11% or 13.5% below ask, depending on whether the buyer paying the flip tax was part of the original terms.

Something real shady going on here, this can't be what it shows at face value.

316 East 22nd st #5 condo/2415 sq ft.
StreetEasy History
12/03/2008Listed by Corcoran at $3,125,000.
12/04/2009Listing is no longer available.
07/12/2010Sale recorded for $(insiders only)$966,810
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/building/316-east-22-street-new_york

525 East 86th Street #10DE: seven-room combination with river views, renovated K and Bs, closed 10% below final ask and 37% below original ask.
04/28/2009 Listed by Modlin Group at $2,490,000.
07/29/2009 Price decreased by 20% to $1,995,000.
11/03/2009 Price decreased by 5% to $1,895,000.
02/16/2010 Price decreased by 8% to $1,750,000.
05/04/2010 Listing entered contract.
08/04/2010 Sale recorded for $1,575,000.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/407132-coop-525-east-86th-street-yorkville-new-york

without aboutready no one is ever going to mention downtown. sniffle...

Here's a downtown closing, although it's on a new development, 100 Eleventh Avenue, #20A. They paid $5.5M for a 3k square foot place - a 30% discount from asking. I'm guessing they played harder ball than their neighbors in #20B who only got a 6% discount. It also puts a bit of downward pressure on the current $7.5M asking price for #19A.

http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/468058-condo-100-eleventh-avenue-chelsea-new-york

ar ar
pls come back from afar

Yeah please AR, your the only one that would have paid attention to my post.

$996K and 2400 sq ft, thats $412 per sq ft on a new construction condo!

I bring you a transaction that defies all NY City
A new contruct condo 2400 sq ft under a milly
Yeah it's off Stuytown which is not too pretty
But it's way below anything even toxic Long Island City

69% below original asking, that's no easy tasking
Beyond price slashing, more like a crashing

So this is my lowball, I don't think it can be beat
No lower can you go, even with a comm toilet seat

I hope this transaction now gets proper attention
As Ive now posted it in SE's seemingly new criteria for mention

truth, developers & architect are living in that building. I looke at the top floors and I believe 3 of the 5 are taken by insiders, 4, 5 and the PH2. I know they were considering for the remaining 2 apts 20% below most recent ask plus they would chuck in a parking space. The 1m price is probably there to take advantage of the 1m mortgage cap.

Lupus. Terrible disease btw.

WTF? A data point that is unreliable? Really in NYC? I mean could this be the yin to the c6 yang? A closing below actual economics? No matter, it's a data point. If the market is so weak that they would fake a closing to save a 1% mansion tax, hold on this ride's gonna be scary.

Yep and equity mkt is starting to capitulate. Rigt bf September capitulation in NYC re. Flmaozzzzzz

lupus
I hear what you saying but I still find it tough to swallow.
I've had this building on my radar for a while, waiting for the 2 PH asking prices to come down before even looking at them.
After a recent release of a federal lien from the IRS however (block 927 lot 0046), I find it hard to believe Sir Howell would offer a big FU to Uncle Sam and play more tax games with a game of........ mansion?....what mansion? But hey, after watching Rangel for over a year, ok, I'll bite.
But then if they are really considering 20% off below recent asks and a parking spot, why is this unit no longer on the market? Considering (after seeing the unit first) that 25% off and the parking spot would likely get me to break out my checkbook.

unit no longer on the market because i would assume one of the insiders took it. when i looked the only ones that were available were ph1 and ph2 and the developer took one of those. not sure which one it was.

941 Park Avenue #78C: After a year, the Blankfeins sacrifice their prewar duplex for 10% off final ask, 19% off the debut price.
05/22/2009 Listed by Stribling at $15,000,000.
06/11/2009 Also Listed by Sotheby's International Realty, Inc. at $15,000,000.
11/23/2009 Price decreased by 10% to $13,500,000.
08/16/2010 Sale recorded for $12,150,000.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/415092-coop-park-avenue-upper-east-side-new-york

Do I list this here?
15 Union Square West, that glass monstrosity in/on Union Square with asking prices(and 2 closings) over $2000 per square foot.
Unit #25, with all the cloak and dagger is a $449 sq ft studio sold for $488K. That's $1086 per square foot. I wonder how those 2 other buyers feel now?
Of course this may have some mandatory pied a terre clause with a 60 day per year max allowance of use.
Or maybe it's a cabana?
Should provide great support for 14 west 14th.

http://streeteasy.com/nyc/building/15-union-square-west-new_york

Truthysk, don't list any negative data. The NYC re bulls will paint us all selfish buyers.

250 West 90th Street #PH4A: New West condo with views, closed 10.4% below final ask.
05/01/1987 Previous sale recorded for $459,000 (ACRIS - approximate).
04/22/2010 Listed by Corcoran at $1,900,000.
05/10/2010 Price decreased by 11% to $1,699,000.
06/24/2010 Price decreased by 4% to $1,629,000.
08/02/2010 Listing entered contract.
09/13/2010 Sale recorded for $1,460,000.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/516300-condo-250-west-90th-street-upper-west-side-new-york

West81st - judging by the "needs TLC" description and the very standard layout, awkward window placementin Living room, and lack of a terrace, I think the sellers still were really really lucky to sell at that price. I don't get why anyone paid that price.

PH41, I thought exactly the same thing when looking at the listing. Few decent options have been available in the past 6 months, so in prime UWS, I'm guessing a lot of newborns and/or school-age kids with the need to move before school starting.

Stop this crap for a second. Everyone get out a copy of the national geographic. Okay look at squirrel nut sack. Now look at an elephant nut sack. Now those are lowballz.

Down Payment $325,800
Mortgage Amount $1,303,200
Mortgage Payment $8,237
Total Monthly Payment $10,780 for a two bedroom in need of TLC. Forget the elephant nut sack, this is just palin nuts.

Clearly, a successful lowball bid doesn't necessary mean the buyer got a bargain, or even a decent deal. It may just mean that an outrageous asking price served its intended purpose.

What is up with this one?

219 West 81st #12G in Upper West Side

06/15/2009
Listed by Avonova Sales Office at $1,570,000.
07/20/2009
Price increased by 13% to $1,775,000.
07/20/2009
Listing entered contract.
12/08/2009
Sale recorded for $1,050,000.

Let's talk new construction or a conversion. It seems like the first few closing ate close to list, but then after that it seems to drop off to 15-20% off list. I am thinking of putting in a bid on a conversion, which just started selling 4 months ago. Right now they only have 5 contracts out. Do you think showing a 15-20% off bid is too much?

151 East 85th (Lucida) #16E: 3BR/3.5BA condo, closed 27.3% below ask.
05/21/2010 Listed by Corcoran at $5,956,500.
08/17/2010 Listing entered contract.
09/16/2010 Listing sold.
09/16/2010 Sale recorded for $4,327,562.
The discount is probably closer to 30%, since the recorded price appears to include transfer taxes, while the asking price does not.

pyxis: #12G debuted in 2007 at $1.67MM, was quickly reduced to $1.57MM and languished for two years before selling for $1.05MM. The sham increase to $1.775MM on the contract date was probably intended to boost other listings in the building. The same sellers crafted the indecipherable Streeteasy history at 55 & 65 West 95th Street.

141 Fifth Avenue #36: 2BR/2.5BA condo, closed 22% below ask.
02/14/2008 Previously Listed by CORE at $4,100,000.
01/21/2010 Listed in StreetEasy, already in contract, by CORE at $4,100,000.
09/20/2010 Sale recorded for $3,200,000.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/490904-condo-141-fifth-avenue-flatiron-new-york

1065 Lexington Avenue #10A: Prewar seven, closed 12.7% below final ask (disregarding the posthumous price cut).
02/22/2010 Listed by Brown Harris Stevens at $2,350,000.
04/28/2010 Price decreased by 6% to $2,200,000.
06/15/2010 Listing entered contract.
09/17/2010 Sale recorded for $1,920,250.
09/21/2010 Price decreased by 13% to $1,920,250.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/497820-coop-1065-lexington-avenue-upper-east-side-new-york

205 East 85th Street (Brompton) #15K: 3BR/3.5BA condo, closed 30.3% below ask.
04/19/2010 Listed by Related Sales at $4,000,000.
06/16/2010 Listing entered contract.
09/17/2010 Sale recorded for $2,787,925.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/515290-condo-205-east-85th-street-yorkville-new-york
As with the Lucida sale above, the recorded price appears to include transfer taxes. The contract price was probably closer to $2.7MM.

So do you think as they get down to their last few apts they are much more neg., or is it that the market has changed so much that they have have to be more neg? I have my eye on a rental conversion on the west side. They only have a few in contract at this point, so I don't know if I should wait to make an offer or do it now. I am not trying to lowball them, I just feel that for the location and the fact that they are still going to have half the building as rent stabilized the prices are a little to high. I was thinking 15-20 off list.

Rob360: I can't really offer a useful opinion without more information. In general, the answer will depend on the specific circumstances of the conversion (especially the amount of time the sponsor has left to get 15% of the apartments into contract), how realistically it is already priced and the amount of cash you can bring to the transaction.

If you're looking at 845 WEA, I don't think the sponsor there is up against a tight deadline yet, but there's no harm trying.

It is 845 west end avenue- great guess! They want to start closing in the spring. Right now they have 5 contracts signed and need 9 more to make the plan effective. Why do you think the developer is not up against a dead line? Do you think it is a problem for future buyers with the current rules of 70% sold and 50% owner occupied? I know I can get a mortgage from their lender, but my broker is very concerned that if I ever have to sell the apt that a buyer wouldn't be able to get financing because this building will never pass that 70/50 test because they only have 50% to sell. Another reason whyninthink the prices should be cheaper.

29 West 85th Street #45PH: Brownstone duplex penthouse, closed 12.6% below final ask, 24% below initial 2009 ask.
05/16/2009 Listed by Prudential Elliman at $5,750,000.
05/21/2009 Price increased by 4% to $5,995,000.
08/19/2009 Price decreased by 8% to $5,495,000.
03/12/2010 Price decreased by 4% to $5,250,000.
03/19/2010 Price decreased by 5% to $4,995,000.
07/17/2010 Listing entered contract.
09/17/2010 Sale recorded for $$4,367,000.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/building/29-west-85-street-manhattan

Not clear whether 2004 sale of "#5" for $3.35MM was the whole duplex or just the fifth floor.

25 Sutton Place South #11G: Six-into-four with views and high maintenance. Closed 15.6% below final ask.
02/10/2010 Listed by Brown Harris Stevens at $2,250,000.
04/14/2010 Price decreased by 12% to $1,975,000.
08/06/2010 Listing entered contract.
10/25/2010 Sale recorded for $1,666,667.

Rob360: Sorry I didn't see your follow-up question sooner. To determine whether the sponsor is up against a deadline, check the filing date of the plan. IIRC, 845 WEA started marketing this spring. If that's correct, they still have a fair amount of time to reach 15%. I agree with your broker about the risk. In principle, the risk should be priced in. In practice, I don't think it is - not in the published prices, anyway.

535 West End Ave. 8451 sq ft for $12.9mm. ==> $1,527 / sq ft!

Is there something about this deal that is not readily apparent from the SE data?

Listed @ $23mm
Sale px: $12.907mm

Now THAT is a loooowwwwwwwwball. That one hit the dirt 20 ft in front of the plate.

http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/365843-condo-535-west-end-avenue-upper-west-side-new-york

"Cosy" 2/1.5 at 21.7% off last ask: http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/498347-coop-23-east-10th-street-greenwich-village-new-york

02/24/2010 Listed by Brown Harris Stevens at $1,295,000.
03/06/2010 Price decreased by 4% to $1,245,000.
04/14/2010 Price decreased by 4% to $1,190,000.
06/17/2010 Price decreased by 3% to $1,150,000.
08/18/2010 Listing sold.
11/05/2010 Sale recorded for $900,000.

1/1 at 17.6% off last ask: http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/490738-coop-39-fifth-avenue-greenwich-village-new-york

01/21/2010 Listed by Halstead Property at $1,300,000.
04/27/2010 Listing entered contract.
06/08/2010 Listing is no longer available.
06/09/2010 Re-listed by Halstead Property.
06/24/2010 Price decreased by 6% to $1,225,000.
09/07/2010 Listing sold. 11/02/2010 Sale recorded for $1,010,000.

401 East 89th Street #3CD: 3BR combo condop with balcony, closed 13% below final ask and 23% below original.
01/22/2010 Listed by Brown Harris Stevens at $1,795,000.
03/02/2010 Price decreased by 6% to $1,695,000.
03/22/2010 Price decreased by 7% to $1,580,000.
07/06/2010 Listing is no longer available.
08/11/2010 Listing entered contract.
11/09/2010 Sale recorded for $1,375,000.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/491135-condop-401-east-89th-street-yorkville-new-york

The chickenscratch floorplan on SE doesn't do the space justice; I think the apartment is over 1,700SF. The big problem here was probably the low floor on a noisy stretch of First Avenue.

No problem. Just the market heading towards my $500psf prediction.

Century Apartments, 17.6% below initial and final ask. quick sale though. decent sized one bedroom. admittedly a small unit, but less than $1000 psf for a condo on CPW, well below other recent sales for similarly sized apartments.

http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/547012-condo-25-central-park-west-lincoln-square-new-york
08/17/2010 Listed by Corcoran at $895,000.
09/17/2010 Listing entered contract.
09/19/2010 Listing sold.
12/06/2010 Sale recorded for $737,200.

15 West 81st Street #6D: Renovated six facing the Museum and Planetarium. Great for empty-nesters; less so for a family, which probably narrowed the buyer pool. Buyers downsized from Fifth Avenue; she's a prominent East Side broker.
05/17/2008 Previously Listed by Brown Harris Stevens at $4,850,000.
06/12/2008 Delisted temporarily by Brown Harris Stevens.
05/03/2010 Listed by Brown Harris Stevens at $4,600,000.
10/05/2010 Listing entered contract.
12/10/2010 Sale recorded for $3,960,000.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/519052-coop-15-west-81st-street-upper-west-side-new-york

The term "Lowball" may not capture what's going on behind the scenes at the Apthorp. The latest closing is #6C, which sold at a 57.4% discount off the alleged asking price:
10/14/2009 Listed in StreetEasy, already in contract, by Prudential Elliman at $9,086,000.
11/10/2010 Listing is no longer available.
12/20/2010 Sale recorded for $3,866,804.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/470969-condo-390-west-end-avenue-upper-west-side-new-york

Interesting, eh? The contract's from 8/2009. Of the closings so far, all but three went to contract that summer, most at $1100-$1300 per square foot. This one got a mortgage, one of a few there.

These buyers are Wall St. partners with recent buyers at 535WEA. I don't know what to believe of the google results.

11 East 86th Street #2C: This Carnegie Hill six-into-seven closed 15.6% below the ask, which had already been reduced $445K.
04/10/2009 Listed by Corcoran at $2,295,000.
07/30/2009 Listing is no longer available.
09/04/2009 Re-listed by Corcoran.
11/21/2009 Price decreased by 13% to $1,995,000.
06/03/2010 Price decreased by 7% to $1,850,000.
10/28/2010 Listing entered contract.
12/29/2010 Sale recorded for $1,600,000.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/403990-coop-11-east-86th-street-carnegie-hill-new-york
This sale has to be unsettling to the owners of #3C, who sought $3MM for their lavishly decorated apartment just before Lehman collapsed.

More coincidences. The 535WEA buyers two posts up also bought 7J and 2A at the Apthorp. Same 8/21 contract date as 6C, also mortgaged. The family is now up to $22M between the Apthorp and 535WEA. It'll be interesting to see how these apparent investments pan out.

314 West 100th St. #56: Small but nicely renovated prewar five in a recent condo conversion.
01/28/2010 Listed by Nestseekers at $1,067,037.
02/04/2011 Listing sold.
02/16/2011 Sale recorded for $896,060.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/492391-condo-314-w-100th-st-upper-west-side-new-york

The difficulty of obtaining financing on a building with a low percentage of units sold was probably a bigger factor than the dearth of closets.

Yeah but how much would that place have gone for if there was a second toilet?

Huntersburg: If it had another bathroom, another bedroom, 1000 more square feet, excellent storage, an established condo, a full-time doorman and top-flight amenities, #56 would have sold for $2MM. And if my uncle had a uterus, he'd be my aunt.

Oh, the old ham and cheese sandwich comeback.

345 East 69th Street #7F: Flexible seller meets serious buyer. Everyone wins - except NYC, which missed out on the mansion tax.
11/03/2010 Listed by Corcoran at $1,150,000.
12/09/2010 Listing entered contract.
02/18/2011 Sale recorded for $995,000.
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/565905-coop-345-east-69th-street-lenox-hill-new-york

West--not sure I'd call that a lowball. Unit was priced decently with just enough pad for downward wiggle room. Wouldn't call the sale a deal either--cookie cutter layout with highish maintenance for the space. All in all traded right at value, IMO.

Wow, you're raising the bar for lowballs. That one's -13.5%, so buyer must've first tried for something more. I'd bet buyer's broker, knowing that most go for -5% or so, said it was a long shot, as sellers weren't ready yet.

It really comes down to your definition of a lowball. I just look at the discount off ask, because my point in posting on this thread is that buyers shouldn't be intimidated by asking prices, or by listing agents who sneer at an offer that's more than 5% below ask. In that context, it doesn't really matter whether the bid or the ask is closer to the market.