Open House Reports, Upper West Side, Sept. 2010
Started by West81st
over 15 years ago
Posts: 5564
Member since: Jan 2008
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Another season begins, and the Streeteasy UWS brigade hits the pavement. I hope others will share their observations, whether exultant, snarky or in between. 895 West End Avenue #12A Coop, 3BR/2BA $2,400,000 (FSBO) Maint. $2372 895 West End is a handsome product of the collaboration between architect Gaetan Ajello and his patrons, the Paternos. Restoration since 1990 has freshened the facade and... [more]
Another season begins, and the Streeteasy UWS brigade hits the pavement. I hope others will share their observations, whether exultant, snarky or in between. 895 West End Avenue #12A Coop, 3BR/2BA $2,400,000 (FSBO) Maint. $2372 895 West End is a handsome product of the collaboration between architect Gaetan Ajello and his patrons, the Paternos. Restoration since 1990 has freshened the facade and more recently the lobby, a stained glass feast for Tiffany enthusiasts. My personal taste runs toward the sobriety of 885 WEA (also Ajello) or the understated elegance of 875 (Candela), but they are all lovely and they all underscore what was lost over the years in the careless treatment of the third Ajello neighbor, 905 WEA. #12A is a smartly reconfigured corner seven, currently being offered for sale directly by the owners. The original "A" floor plan evinces the lifestyle of the 1912 bourgeoisie: an oversized formal dining room is flanked by a rather small living room (technically a parlor) and a narrow kitchen, with a narrower maid's room beyond. In #12A, the public space is reallocated: the former parlor is now a library that can also accommodate overnight guests; the huge dining room is now a generous living room; and the service wing has been opened up as a unified cooking/dining area, with laundry facilities to the rear. I think it's an optimal use of the "A" footprint for modern living, although it means dinner guests can see the mess in the kitchen and may be a bit "fifteen years ago" for some buyers. As we have discussed elsewhere, this layout works especially well for families with young children. The family wing remains mostly as-built. The layout is unchanged and the bathrooms are original. The master bedroom at the rear of the apartment retains a shaving closet that is separate from the adjacent shower and commode. Although these could probably be combined into a full master bath, buyers who want a big spa-like bathroom should probably look elsewhere. The MBR is the one room not reached by the dual-zone central air system; extending the ductwork might entail dropping a ceiling or incurring significant cost. The current owners used the front, corner BR as their master, and the next owner might follow suit. The renovation does show some age, and certain finishes are dated. For example, the cushioned cabinet doors and tilt-and-turn replacement windows are quite functional, but I don't think many designers would put them in a pre-WWI coop today. From a mechanical standpoint, the A/C and appliances seem to be holding up well. The renovation also capitalized on the advantages of the top-floor: ductwork and venting run upward to the roof, so the impressive ceiling height and arched window forms have not been compromised, and light and air have been maximized. The original floors are light and pleasant, but may be nearing the end of their useful life; I saw some inelegant repairs, and I'm not sure the original boards would respond well to another refinishing. When this listing first appeared last week, I was taken aback by the price. The high-water mark for 895 WEA is $2.15MM, established in 2006 by #10A and matched in 2007 by #5B. After seeing #12A, my view has softened because this is arguably the best apartment in the building and should command a premium. $2.4MM still seems ambitious, given the age and limited scope of the renovation; but in the context of its current competition - particularly the condo conversions at 845 and 905 WEA, plus recent sales at 885 WEA - the owners may have the right idea. [less]
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Great Review! Something else worth noting is how this particular apartment epitomizes the "worst feature" of WEA -- the seemingly ubiquitous LACK of view. I agree with you that this is likely the premier apartment in the building with its corner location on the top floor and, even with that positioning, there's not a single view to be had anywhere in the entire space. It's locked in all directions by mammoth buildings of equal height. No "slice of the river" ... no "open city view" ... no nothing! There are, of course, parts of WEA that have lowrise buildings and/or brownstones allowing for great views from the apartments on high floors opposite them. But, WEA, with its rows of grand dame buildings, really is for those who aren't interested in light or views.
I do fully believe that owners who want to FSBO should but I'm often surprised at the poor quality of the DIY photos, and this is no exception.
I haven't seen this apartment yet in person, but it seems to need better lighting, rearranged furniture and window treatments.
For starters, that pillow should come off the floor in the library. I keep thinking the family pet has just been kidnapped.
ali r.
DG Neary Realty
670 West End Avenue #7C
Coop, 2BR/2BA
$1,495,000, Maint. $1754
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/551790-coop-670-west-end-avenue-upper-west-side-new-york
The stars at 670 WEA are the oversized sixes and sevens in the "D" and "F" lines. While those big, front apartments enable the building to compete for $2MM+ buyers, the rear side of 670 hosts a very respectable selection of classic fives that trade at more reasonable price points.
#7C is a north-facing five in decent estate condition. The rooms are well-proportioned, especially the 24x14 living room. The size and position of the formal dining room offers some flexibility to create a home office; a third bedroom would be less feasible, and would entail significant compromises. Most of the original details remain, under layers of paint. The LR and MBR have reasonable air and northern light. The other three rooms face walls. Closet space is not bad, and would be fairly easy to enhance.
The next owner will surely freshen the 80s kitchen, which is outdated and functionally obsolete (though I've seen far worse). The kitchen is wide enough to accommodate a lot of different renovation options, and can be partly opened to the dining room.
The original baths will need attention too. The awkward position of the master bath - at the end of a narrow corridor that is partly obstructed by the linen closet - makes reconfiguring the bedroom wing a likely priority. The Elliman listing includes an alternate floor plan that incorporates that bathroom into a master suite and adds a walk-in closet. The drawback is the loss of easy bathroom access for guests. A simpler option is to use the second bedroom, with its small en-suite bath, as the master. That might make sense for a family with multiple children, who would share the front BR.
#7C is in direct competition with another new listing, #12E, which will be reviewed separately. Price discovery should be forthcoming from #6A, a five-room wreck priced $200K lower that is currently in contract. I think the "A" line is weaker overall; but of the three lines, the "C" footprint is probably the hardest to convert to 3BR. Even a buyer who doesn't need the third bedroom should consider that limitation for resale.
Does anyone go to these open houses???
W81- thanks for returning the site to it's glorious days. Finally there is something to read and compare to other RE options in the city.
Keep them coming W. 81
Enjoy reading both the factual information and your subjective take.
Is it safe to assume that anybody buying that place in that neighborhood is looking solely to private schools?
W. 81, thanks! Great to have these back...
007/junkie/OTNYC: It beats playing whack-a-troll.
Malthus: Not necessarily. They could already be secure in a different D3 elementary (including the district-wide G&T programs), or they might be OK with the zoned school. Also, there are some excellent, selective-admission public middle schools in the 100s - arguably better than what's available in "prime" UWS. (I'm assuming your question was about 895 WEA.)
Bronxboy: Yes.
That's right. Thanks. I like the area and also like that it seems to be discounted to the rest of the UWS and always assumed that was because of schools but its not something I honestly know a lot about, having always lived downtown.
670 West End Avenue #12E
Coop, 2BR/2BA
$1,495,000, Maint. $1959
http://streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/549095-coop-670-west-end-avenue-upper-west-side-new-york
#12E presents slightly different opportunities - and challenges - than the competition five floors below. Here, the dining room has been opened to the living room, but could be converted quite easily to a small third BR or study if needed; in fact, the dining area already has a doorway leading to the bedroom wing, which makes the conversion even easier. Note that the joined public space isn't as expansive as it looks in the pictures; the mirrored wall in the dining area might trick you at first. Still, what would remain after walling off the third BR would be an ample living/dining area. So if you need three bedrooms, I think #12E gets the nod over #7C.
#12E also starts out with a more sensible layout in the bedroom wing. The master is large, and has a full en-suite bath. A stall shower that's accessible from either bathroom is a little weird; that's easily solved if privacy trumps efficiency. The bathrooms need freshening anyway. The second bedroom, while not huge, is quite adequate and enjoys a pleasant northern exposure over 93rd Street. Even the prospective third bedroom would get good light through a large, south-facing window.
Storage space is ample. The floors appeared to be in pretty good shape; the second bedroom is stained much darker than the rest of the apartment, an issue that can be remedied during refinishing. Original mill/plasterwork remains, but is so heavily coated with paint that details are badly obscured.
The good news about #12E stops at the kitchen door. There must be a better way to arrange the kitchen, but I haven't figured out how to do it without sacrificing the washer/dryer. As things stand, opening the refrigerator requires the skill of a contortionist, the reach of a left tackle or the waistline of a runway model. The new owners will probably gut the kitchen anyway, and the best option might be to open it, at least part, to the dining area.
Before leaving 670 WEA, I should note that the coop is finally making headway on long-deferred refurbishment of the common areas. The design choices appear bland and safe. So far, the work has not required assessments. I think the face-lift will go a long way toward addressing one of the building's nagging weaknesses.
Saw several co-op apartments this afternoon. Saw a 3 bedroom, 2 bath apartment (6D) at 315 West 86th Street. Was formerly 2 one bedroom units. The w/d is in a closet in what is now the nursery, but was formely a kitchen. The current kitchen is very cramped, but has a little breakfast nook. Apartment showed beautifully-very clean, everything in its place. Perfect for someone with two small children, although all bedrooms and the living room are pretty small in size. No real dining area in the apartment.
Also saw Apt. 12E at 670 WEA (93rd Street). Decent space, nice floors, beamed ceilings. Kitchen needs serious updating. Bathrooms shared a Jack and Jill shower. Floor hallways were ghastly, very poorly maintained.
Oh lobster, I most likely saw you today (at 315 w 86)! But I found the living room quite large.
About the apartment: I believe that a couple with two small children are actually the sellers, so go figure.
The location is, in my book, one of the best in the whole of Manhattan. There are no buses on this block, and no highway exit, so the block hits Riverside Drive, and it's absolutely charming. The presence of 545 WEA doesn't hurt, either.
I liked the apartment but for a family of 2. They'll have a 2-bed, 2 bath apartment with a study; the extra bathroom can be a full-time laundry room.
It's a very nice combination with a very, very reasonable maintenance. I was with a friend of mine who is, she believes, a perfect candidate: a couple in their late 30s, in academia, with a huge dog. She's coming back with her better half to make a decision.
commoner - you have got to be a broker. Also, there is no "extra" bath - it's a 2 bath apartment.
ph41 - no. I am not a broker of anything, RE included. If that's how you wish to tone the discussion, go ahead.
Converting a second bathroom, for a childless couple, is the matter of priorities.
Thanks W81! Finally something worth reading on SE!
West81st - I'm starting to seriously look on the UWS for an apt and I think you might be a great broker to cut through all the BS and tell me what I can and cannot reasonably expect in my price range. Financials are strong but definitely need guidance on what should be important to me - for example I look at all the brand new condos (Saw the Harrison today) when I probably really want a 10 yr old bldg in good shape due to the massive difference in ppsq.
How can I contact you to set some thing up?
I thought West81 was with www.theburkhardtgroup.com
but I don't see you listed with the agents.....
racerdavenyc: Thank you for asking. Just put "michael" in front of "@theburkhardtgroup.com". As mjsalisb noted, I keep a low profile; but I'm still collaborating with Keith B., and all is well.
You pose an interesting question about ten-year-old buildings. There aren't many of them, aside from the first Trumpville condos. Twenty-year old construction (from the last boom) is relatively plentiful, and trades at a significant discount to Harrison, or even Ariel. Buildings like New West and Savannah are not widely loved, so they can offer relatively good value to a buyer who isn't put off by their limitations and is willing to tackle the needed updates.
Thanks for the response, W81. I'm really looking in the low to mid 70s, so New West and Savannah would be way out of the range in terms of area. One building I've noticed on my own that seems close is the Alexandria on 72nd, built in 1991. I'll shoot you an email...
commoner, it seems like a very friendly building - lots of kids and dogs and lots of people taking their bicycles out for a ride on a nice Sunday afternoon. You're right about the living room and, of course, the master bedroom has that wonderful walk-in closet. The absence of a real dining area is the one drawback. But it was beautifully renovated and very very clean. The current nursery would make a nice study.
Not sure if this is going to qualify as an open house report, but I thought it was worth sharing anyway. This weekend we went to see 306 West 100th St #41 thinking there was an open house on Sunday (we were off by a week). We were excited to see a grand old 7-room apartment in a somewhat worn but architecturally appealing building. As it happened, we didn't get a chance to peek inside #41, but did we get value for our money!!! In the hallway, half-slipped under the door of an adjacent apartment was a notice from building management. I couldn't help reading the leading sentence "In our ongoing effort to eradicate the bedbug infestation in the building... blah... blah... blah..." It took us about 30 seconds to get out of the building and head to a less dangerous open house down WEA.
895 West End Avenue #12A appears to be off the market now. Could it have found a buyer so quickly?
Aptometrist: Yes.
It was a tempting listing, I must admit, West81st. Comparing to 845 WEA and other inventory in that stretch, it was positioned quite well.
@aptometrist: That's not what the flyer said. You either misread it or are misreporting it. I know because I wrote the flyer. It said, "As part of our ongoing effort to keep bed bugs out of our building, please see the attached reading materials with regards to bed bug prevention." Attached was a pamphlet from the NYC Department of Health which offered bedbug advice.
306W100, apologies if I misquoted/misread your pamphlet. I would hate to give your building an undeserved reputation and this wasn't my intent! (No horse in that race anyway.) I suppose my eyes were drawn to key operative words like "ongoing" and "bedbugs" and I may not have properly interpreted the "keep out" part. In retrospect, "keep out" is significantly different from "eradicate," I must admit. In any case, next time I'll either read more carefully or not read at all, as it wasn't meant for my eyes...
When will open house reports look at listings at less than seven figures? I thought you Wall Street bonus types and hedge fund cowboys were a thing of the past?
There are listings in manhattan below 7 figures? ;)