Hi - I have seen several previous threads discuss costs for townhouse renovations. These have typically been expressed in per square foot terms, with 150-300 being cited often, and some as high as 500. I am planning such a project and will soon be consulting with architects to start the process. I have sketched out a very broad budget below, expressed by 'project', rather than per square foot (I... [more]
Hi - I have seen several previous threads discuss costs for townhouse renovations.
These have typically been expressed in per square foot terms, with 150-300 being cited often, and some as high as 500.
I am planning such a project and will soon be consulting with architects to start the process. I have sketched out a very broad budget below, expressed by 'project', rather than per square foot (I feel that is more useful given so much of the costs are in discrete projects/areas, rather than variable by square footage).
This is for a 4 story townhouse of approximately 2800 square feet and a 'gut' renovation. Objective is a high end kitchen and 1 out of 3 bathrooms high end, and other areas being more middle of the road, but durable and energy efficient. Would appreciate any thoughts or comments from those more experienced - am I missing any major categories, and I am over or under-shooting dramatically in certain areas? Thanks
Architect, GC, expediter, permits, insurance - 150k
Systems - electrical, central AC, gas heat, plumbing, security, home automation - 200k
Demolition - 25k
New drywall, floor, ceilings - 100k
New staircase - 50k
Kitchen and bathrooms - 150k
Paint - 25k
New windows - 50k
Landscaping and deck - 50k
Roof and deck- 50k
Total - 850k, or $304/sf
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Response by front_porch
about 13 years ago
Posts: 5321
Member since: Mar 2008
I think the price of what you pay to improve a property should somewhat scale with the property -- so $150K on the kitchen and 3 bathrooms may be fine, but it also may not be high-end enough. Where is this townhouse?
ali r.
DG Neary Realty
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Response by ab_11218
about 13 years ago
Posts: 2017
Member since: May 2009
you are putting too many things together.
central air for 4 story house can be $15K to $50K depending on what you want
gas heat, if using existing radiators and lines, can be $15K or if everything new, $50K
home automation can be as little as $10K or as much at $100K
what kind of floors are you looking for? they can range from $10 sft to $30.
are you doing some special mouldings?
kitchen and bathroom number is definitely low as you want high-end. the kitchen alone can run $100K and the high-end bath $50K. you can find vanities that cost $7-10K and baths for about the same.
the first number does sound a little high though.
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Response by nyc10023
about 13 years ago
Posts: 7614
Member since: Nov 2008
When you finish demo, you might find some $$$ structural issues - e.g. rotting joists. Are you replacing subfloors? Agree that you could be under-estimating systems cost - are you replacing sewer to street? Adding extra electrical capacity (you should if you can)? Facade repair/reprinting? Doors, moldings, millwork? Fireplace restoration (steel liner + firebricks)? Original detail restoration?
Any structural demo/expansion? Now is the time to do it.
The overall number is doable, in general. Won't buy you a luxe renovation unless you are your own GC.
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Response by hawaiismurf
about 13 years ago
Posts: 1
Member since: Dec 2012
Thanks for the feedback, appreciate it.
To answer some of the questions, it is in the East Village.
For floors, likely to go for white oak hardwood.
Automation system, think Control4, seems more easily scalable.
Not particularly special mouldings.
Yes, adding electrical capacity, and looking to do new wiring throughout.
Not many original details to restore.
Structural demo/expansion - not much to do, but staircase is in bad shape, so needs replacement or major rehab.
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Response by nyc10023
about 13 years ago
Posts: 7614
Member since: Nov 2008
Is it the haunted gottlieb house on east 10th?
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Response by dc10023
about 13 years ago
Posts: 85
Member since: Jun 2008
How does a townhouse get fully renovated without any records in DOB (and therefore no bump in taxes)? I saw a listing of such. Was it illegally renovated or can some renovations be done by owner without filing with the city (legally)?
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Response by spanky3604
about 13 years ago
Posts: 58
Member since: Jun 2008
dc,
I can't speak to the listing/bldg. you saw,but IMHO this would be almost impossible to accomplish at the present time for any of the following reasons: You cannot get water main or electrical service upgrade;neighbors would most likely call 311 and cause a "stop work order" to be placed on bldg;engineer and architect will not "stamp" plans;no reputable electrician,plumber,mechanical contractor or general contractor would take on a project of this magnitude without plans filed and permits pulled;no insurance co. would honor a claim on your end or from the trades;no gas/electric/water meter work could be done;on and on and on.The scenario you describe was more common years ago but would be very difficult or impossible to accomplish today.BTW,the Dept. of Finance does review Dept. of Buildings filings,so your concern is a valid one, but I don't see a way to make this work with a satisfactory conclusion. good luck.
I think the price of what you pay to improve a property should somewhat scale with the property -- so $150K on the kitchen and 3 bathrooms may be fine, but it also may not be high-end enough. Where is this townhouse?
ali r.
DG Neary Realty
you are putting too many things together.
central air for 4 story house can be $15K to $50K depending on what you want
gas heat, if using existing radiators and lines, can be $15K or if everything new, $50K
home automation can be as little as $10K or as much at $100K
what kind of floors are you looking for? they can range from $10 sft to $30.
are you doing some special mouldings?
kitchen and bathroom number is definitely low as you want high-end. the kitchen alone can run $100K and the high-end bath $50K. you can find vanities that cost $7-10K and baths for about the same.
the first number does sound a little high though.
When you finish demo, you might find some $$$ structural issues - e.g. rotting joists. Are you replacing subfloors? Agree that you could be under-estimating systems cost - are you replacing sewer to street? Adding extra electrical capacity (you should if you can)? Facade repair/reprinting? Doors, moldings, millwork? Fireplace restoration (steel liner + firebricks)? Original detail restoration?
Any structural demo/expansion? Now is the time to do it.
The overall number is doable, in general. Won't buy you a luxe renovation unless you are your own GC.
Thanks for the feedback, appreciate it.
To answer some of the questions, it is in the East Village.
For floors, likely to go for white oak hardwood.
Automation system, think Control4, seems more easily scalable.
Not particularly special mouldings.
Yes, adding electrical capacity, and looking to do new wiring throughout.
Not many original details to restore.
Structural demo/expansion - not much to do, but staircase is in bad shape, so needs replacement or major rehab.
Is it the haunted gottlieb house on east 10th?
How does a townhouse get fully renovated without any records in DOB (and therefore no bump in taxes)? I saw a listing of such. Was it illegally renovated or can some renovations be done by owner without filing with the city (legally)?
dc,
I can't speak to the listing/bldg. you saw,but IMHO this would be almost impossible to accomplish at the present time for any of the following reasons: You cannot get water main or electrical service upgrade;neighbors would most likely call 311 and cause a "stop work order" to be placed on bldg;engineer and architect will not "stamp" plans;no reputable electrician,plumber,mechanical contractor or general contractor would take on a project of this magnitude without plans filed and permits pulled;no insurance co. would honor a claim on your end or from the trades;no gas/electric/water meter work could be done;on and on and on.The scenario you describe was more common years ago but would be very difficult or impossible to accomplish today.BTW,the Dept. of Finance does review Dept. of Buildings filings,so your concern is a valid one, but I don't see a way to make this work with a satisfactory conclusion. good luck.