do i need a broker to buy?

No, chances are you can negotiate a better price because the listing broker can cut commission to make deal work. Go for it.

Only a broker who's professional in the business can get the best deal for you.

what does "who's professional in the business" mean?

"Only a broker who's professional in the business can get the best deal for you."

One of the funniest post I ever read.

inoeverything is clearly a broker lol

It sounds like you are a pretty savy person so I wouldn't bother with the broker. Here is a good line I used in the past when I was trying to buy a place and the Seller's broker didn't want to take me seriously... I asked if they would take me more seriousy when they are halving their commissions with my broker since they wouldn't deal with me directly... Suddenly they were dealing... I hired a broker anyways.. My buddy.

you are at a disadvantage when you are NOT negotiating directly with the seller's broker

Hey swit you are right YOU and I mean swit is at a disadvantage not me

I have written about this multiple times (I am a real estate agent and writer, with a book out, and articles in Money magazine etc.)

The problem is that no one really knows, because it's impossible to do a double-blind study where the same person buys an apartment with and without a broker.

The clients who do hire me, as buyers, hire me to shop (a part you've already done), to negotiate, and to close.

It is generally agreed that most people don't do their best negotiating for themselves. It's also generally agreed that if you go directly to the seller's broker, there is a piece of the brokerage commission that is possibly available for recapture.

So the question becomes, "What is the size of that commmission available for recapture and can I, negotiating for myself, capture it and get more of a discount than a professional negotiator can?"

The answer to that is very case-specific. I have seen one deal on the Upper East Side where a buyer overpaid by hundreds of thousands so that he could "save" money by going straight to the seller and getting them to shave just one hundred thousand off the price. Clearly, he *would* have been served by using a broker. I have also seen a deal in Gramercy where the buyer went straight to the seller's broker, and did as well for himself as I could have done. Clearly, he *didn't* need a broker to negotiate.

Unfortunately, I can't tell whether you're in group one or group two because I don't have enough information.

The other factor to consider is closing -- even though you should hire a good real estate attorney (which will run you about $1,500) there is still work to be done examining the building's financials, making sure your appraisal comes in at the right number and that your mortgage comes through, that your walk-through goes smoothly and that everything is in good physical shape. If the pricing test comes out equal if you hire a broker, then you absolutely want one to ride herd on all these bits.

ali r.
{downtown broker}

Front porch What kind of a statement is it is generally agreed that most people don't do there best negotiating for themselves. I for one certainly don't agree to that. I negotiate harder because that real estate purchase is one of the biggest I will make in my entire life. As for shopping thats what this site is for. If used right there is no need for brokers anymore, at least not for me, sorry to be so cold but those are the facts.

zorter: if you don't want to use a broker it is your choice -- I don't market to people who don't want to use brokers but people that do.

But the very fact that the real estate purchase is one of the biggest you will make in your life is what will cloud your communication. I have seen so many customers come to my listings without their brokers and think they're not signaling -- but you signal with what you wear, how quickly you move through the apartment, what you say, and what you don't say. And that's just the first visit.

Usually, a pro who is at arm's-length will do a better job. I have a client who is one of the top real estate lawyers in the city, and for her purchase, she has hired a different real estate lawyer. Similarly, when a lawyer sues someone, he or she generally hires another lawyer.

I'm a fantastic negotiator for other people -- not least because I do it over and over again -- but when Hubby and I buy again (probably in the next twelve months) I will get someone else from my firm to act as my buyer's broker.

That's not saying that YOU have to get an agent, just that having an agent benefits most people. Allewnewbie asked me what I thought, and that's what I think.

ali r.
{downtown broker}

Having recently purchased an apartment there, I'd say you should use a broker. I've brought properties in CA and Vancouver, and NY is, in so many ways, a completely anachronistic and old-fashioned market (the closing process is a joke, there's no protection for the buyer, etc). My sense is that you aren't taken seriously unless you have a broker. I suppose if you're smart and gutsy you could do it (and maybe save some money) but if I were you I'd get a good broker.

DON'T GET A BROKER!! Find out what the comps are in the building to determine value of the apartment. Then mention to Seller's broker that he will be getting full commission if he works with you. Make a bid that takes into account the comps, how long the apt has been on the market and how eager the seller is to move on. Start with a low figure and see what the seller responds with. Have a number in mind in which you will not go above. It's a game that will be played with or without a broker. You are a savvy buyer - do not succumb to the marketing of the real estate brokers - they are out for themselves! Good luck.

As this is a condo, no need for a broker. Coops can be a little tricker for a first time buyer. After that though, no broker required.