Buildings with vented range hood

Bump. I just did a google search of streeteasy talk to see if there were discussions of vented appliances and this came back in my search results. With that said, in response to OP question, the answer is an undeniable yes. I am researching at this moment (point of my google search) how this is done in prewar buildings. My building has quite a few ranges that vent to the outside, which fact runs contrary to what I previously understood to be a limitation of prewar construction.

My current and prior homes have vented ranges. The prior is new dev from several years ago, the current is very far prewar. They’re at high price points, which might correlate to vented hoods.

Harder to find than you'd think because 1) no one in Manhattan cooks (except, apparently, nada) and 2) there's often a tradeoff between whether kitchen or laundry is vented and often a building's designers pick laundry. So to find a vented kitchen range, you end up looking at really new buildings and paying $2500 a sq. ft., or buying someone else's really nice renovation.

50 Riverside Boulevard (aka One Riverside Park) built 2015, definitely does. 10 Riverside Boulevard (aka One Waterline Square), built 2019, should, and I believe 96+ Bway (250 West 96th Street) built 2022, does, but I last saw it on previews so double-check me on that. There's a loft in the Julliard building that does, but I think that's the renovation of that particular unit, not building-wide.

ali r.
{upstairs realty}

I recently did a search of "luxury" (but not billionaire) apartments on UES and found just one that doesn't have a gas stove and just one whose gas stove is vented. Knowing what we now know about the dangers of gas stoves, it's amazing developers of high end buildings aren't going all induction. A gas stove is like a harvest gold fridge - a sign a place hasn't been renovated properly

Consistent with Inonada's theory (thx nada!), I just checked listings at River House and saw some monster ranges vented to the outside (e.g., check out 11A), so it is clearly a thing in high end pre-war. With that said, I tend towards George's perspective in that the prevalence of these things make me somewhat nervous because I just can't imagine that buildings pay any attention to duct maintenance, etc., and with 100 year-old buildings I fear for what is lurking in the there.

@George - early days on getting rid of gas stoves, no?
Feel like high end sentiment turned on that too recently for developers to have reacted and have inventory on the market.

>>A gas stove is like a harvest gold fridge - a sign a place hasn't been renovated properly<<

Love me a harvest gold fridge though! Re: venting--during my recent prewar reno we had to decide whether to vent the range or dryer through an existing vent line... It was a difficult decision but ultimately we chose the range because we love to cook. But I agree with Ali that a lot of NYC buyers may not be as interested in serious cooking so the vented range may not be much of a selling point.

I would suggest if you're looking at prewar buildings, your best bet would be to find one with a windowed kitchen that either faces or has a wall adjacent to the courtyard. It would likely be easier to get permission to create a new opening for a vent in that case.

Also, it is not unusual for prewar apartments to already have some sort of original vent opening and duct (sometimes no longer functioning) that can be retrofit to accommodate a modern range vent. This is what we were able to do and so far we love it.

George/Nada, What do you think of S9 in the attached? House 4 had very little benzene concentration even without the hood. That is to me raises a very important question. Why is there is such a huge difference in House 1 and 4 without the hood on. Perhaps just the present of duct to outdoors without the hood on. If you use a charcoal filter, perhaps most of the benzene is gone. Or simple open a window for 20 minutes.

https://pubs.acs.org/doi/suppl/10.1021/acs.est.2c09289/suppl_file/es2c09289_si_001.pdf
https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acs.est.2c09289

I don't understand why everyone can't just use windows to vent their gas ranges. That is what we opted for in our renovation. My (limited) understanding is that placement of operable windows was a calculated thing during the pre-war era to give apartments great cross-ventilation. While we have not been in our apartment much since we put in our new awesome windows, I will say that the fresh air they provided when I was there for Mr. MCR's extended trial earlier this year was glorious.

I have no clue / idea. I have not been following the whole gas stove thing. I know something exists but don’t care to know what it is, until it becomes impossible to stay 100% ignorant through sheer force of mass, like Instagram or the Kardashians. Then, I’ll become 99% ignorant, knowing just enough to secretly judge, but no more.

Oh Lord, y’all gotten me started!!!

To me, the purpose of a vented range is so that when you drop a hunk of meat on cast iron for its crust, you don’t end up filling your trophy jewel box of an apartment with smoke & grease. Grease film on floor-to-ceiling glass is unseemly! These days, my favorite activity seems to be cooking meat over a hardwood fire pit and being left with a patina of smoke from the process, a fair quantity which gets inhaled.

Meanwhile, in my search to see what the discussion is about, this is one of the first things that pops up:

https://www.treehugger.com/us-gas-stove-regulations-air-pollution-risks-7092797

“Do not hang your baby over a gas stove on an island without a hood.”

Uhh, OK, thanks treehuggers.com. A little advice. If your audience is hanging their babies over a stove while cooking — WTF???? — perhaps there are more proximate concerns than pollution and asthma.

I am still waiting for you to get curious enough about that page s9 from Stanford study.

From the Stanford study: "Mean benzene emissions from gas and propane burners on high and ovens set to 350 °F ranged from 2.8 to 6.5 μg min–1, 10 to 25 times higher than emissions from electric coil and radiant alternatives; neither induction stoves nor the food being cooked emitted detectable benzene. Benzene produced by gas and propane stoves also migrated throughout homes, in some cases elevating bedroom benzene concentrations above chronic health benchmarks for hours after the stove was turned off."

As for developers who continue to install gas stoves, I get why they do it. It's cheaper than induction and most people don't yet know the difference. But they are learning. If you're going to call yourself a luxury building, you shouldn't have redneck sh!t like gas stoves.

George,

I read the Stanford study. There is no doubt there are benzene emissions from gas stoves. But how do you explain House 4 not going above the risky Benzene levels despite the hood being turned off? From page s9 of the link. Am I not understanding that graph correctly? NYC code requirement also require forced extraction of stale air in kitchen and bathrooms for new buildings.

It seems to me that open a window for 10-20 minutes and you don't have any thing to worry about or use a carbon filter if you are really anal.

By the way, what about Electro Magnetic field risks from Induction which are still being researched.

"Harder to find than you'd think because 1) no one in Manhattan cooks "

Hey! I cook close to 100% of my own meals!

With this push to convert everything to electric, our grid is close to capacity. We already have rolling brown outs in the summertime (mostly in poor neighborhoods). What do we think is going to happen in the winters when we add huge amounts of electricity demand?

@George - its hilarious to me you are calling gas stoves redneck
Less than 5-10 years ago, gas stoves were very much a Veblen good in NYC. Everyone who didn't put a viking gas stove in their apartment was some kind of chump.

I can only assume that overpriced enough induction ranges were subsequently invented, which is why they are suddenly fashionable.

If you look at the most expensive new development listing in Streeteasy, you would find it hard to find induction. Gas is actually more expensive as you need gas infrastructure. Imaging a black out and you can’t eat. I can see a case for gas and induction combo in the future. Basically 2 cooktops side by side.

"redneck sh*t" - George's tongue-in-cheek snobbery always makes me smile. I suspect he has been dragged into the milieu in which he lives with mixed feelings as evidenced by his refusal to cave into the cultural aspect of that milieu that views home ownership through the lens of consumption rather than investment.

And my sincere hope is that Inonada turns his analytical skills towards relative health risks of induction vs gas - inquiring minds like mine want to know but are too lazy to research and are more than happy to defer to better minds.

As somebody who spends more time in the subway system than I spend cooking on my apartment's gas stove (not a Viking, but not a no-name brand either), and breathing in all the gunk emitted by subway car motors and brakes, let alone all the airborne junk on the street, I wish people had some sense of proportion about the dangers of cooking with gas. It mostly smacks of hysteria by people who don't want to tackle real issues.

@300 - It didn't even occur to me, and you have hit the new Double Veblen good for hot new reno haha.
When does Viking offer a $20k dual-fuel stove?

Seriously though re: power outages, theres a startup making very cool induction ranges with built in battery - https://www.impulselabs.com/blog/impulse-labs-series-a-annoucement

I believe the battery serves three purposes - run stove during power outages, allow for higher peak power than other induction stoves and load/demand smoothing.

Note they mention you can hook into your existing panel. Idea it passively keeps the battery charged, runs the induction stove DC off the battery (maybe also drips charge it off the regular 120V while in use too).

Agree. And where are we going to get all the cooper? Put up huge batteries for power back-up and then we have to worry about all the metals which go into these batteries. It is a mania!! I do have to acknowledge that it will impact what apartment buyers ask for in the future.

Signed: 60 inch commercial gas stove owner.

Vented with hood into a building duct which has additional fan on the roof. Opening a window is still needed after smoky cooking.

My gas stove is vented to the outside. Done as part of a gut reno to a prewar apartment when I bought the place. My gas dryer also vents to the outside.

Steve, In my opinion, future best resale configuraton will likely be: Two modular cook-tops side by side (gas and induction). Electric oven at the bottom. People can change the cook-tops to what they like as they are not that expensive. Critical to have enough electric capacity. Not much price difference between gas and induction cook tops.
https://www.subzero-wolf.com/wolf/configurator#sort=%40displayorder%20descending&numberOfResults=21&wolfcategory=Module%20Cooktops

I have researched this heavily for a new project. The code already has adequate venting in the kithchen via central duct with fan on the roof and in-unit kitchen exhaust fan. Range hood or eqt is just a bonus.

Hmm, putting massive lithium ion batteries in every stove sounds like a building I won't be moving into

under counter hidden induction has to be the future

I think George may be getting an induction cooktop alongwith 5KW storage battery in his rental and opposing the batterry powered bikes due to fire risk ;).

I've actually been looking at putting one of those Impulse Labs induction + battery cooktops in my house in Nowhere (which is all electric). I have an electrical monitoring system installed in the house which can detect electrical anomalies inside the house, so I'm less worried about fires.

Yes the air in some places sucks but I can't control the busses; I can control what's in my house. It's great that at one measuring point, House 4 didn't have bad air but maybe the airflow in the house is from the measuring point towards the kitchen not the opposite.

George, Ha.. Are you really trying to justify seemingly critical flaw in Stanford's reseach piece? They have an agenda. Otherwise, they would have simply added an additional test with say 1 and 2 square foot window openings and shown the impact. Afterall, they were testing in houses not even multi-family buildings.

By the way, battery malfunction and potential fire will not be detected by electrical monitoring system. It is best to keep the battery outside your house as you are not constrained by apartment dweller limitation of having to keep the battery inside. And in your NYC rental, just crack open the window when you cook.

So much of the "research" is being pushed by those with extreme financial interest in battery/etc production while leaving out some of the extreme challenges in the production and disposal (ad well as risks during use).

George, You need to get one of these and invite us all for a party.

https://www.garland-group.com/product/fam_cjirvc/US-Range-U-Series-Gas-Ranges-60-Wide-Range-with-Raised-GriddleBroiler

According to BusinessWeek just 0.3% of natural gas consumption was home stoves. I think we're seeing cases of the most extreme fringe elements controlling the narrative for some of the most important factors which influence our future. There are so many other things which are more important than to be focusing this much energy on such an unimportant issue. What are they trying to keep us from looking at instead?

The Douglass (2110 FDB) has vented ranges and vented dryers that go to the outside.

How much does it costs a builder to have vented washer/dryer, vented kitchen, and central air / heating & cooling?

Less than $2500 for vented washer/dryer and vented Kitchen in a free standing house.

11 Hoyt in Brooklyn vents to the outside.